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1300fwd engine / crankcase removal


PeteStupps

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Hello all.

I am the proud owner of a 1967 1300fwd, purchased last autumn. Very nice and tidy but zero history (reg OLT 655E, please tell me if it was yours!).

On draining the oil last year I was alarmed to find a piece of metal about half the size of a tic-tac came out of the sump. Hence I felt the need to have a look at the bottom end, which is a bit of a chore on these cars!

So I thought I could lift the crankcase bit of the engine off, leaving the gearbox and diff in place. Followed the advice in the workshop manual but I cannot get the flippin input shaft out! Had a puller on it and wound it up as much as I dared but it won't pull out. The shaft will move back and forth a bit but will not come out.

Next plan: I thought if I loosened off the clutch and took all the sump bolts out, I might be able to just move the crankcase forward enough to get it clear of the input shaft. After lots of heaving and ho-ing standing in the engine bay, this approach has got me nowhere.

Any ideas welcome! Do I have to take the whole lot out in one go then? And if I do that, will I be able to get the input shaft out?! I don't really know how to proceed so have been ignoring it for a few weeks but want to get it all back together for Easter if I can.

Any advice or encouragement gratefully received.
Pete

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Ah of course, I remember reading about using a slide hammer, but dismissed it because I haven't got one! But money spent on tools never feels like a waste so I best get hold of one.

Thanks very much - and yes its got the red interior. Hopefully it will look as tidy as it used to when I get it all back together! They are handsome cars indeed.

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that is pretty!

Yep the way forward will be a slide hammer.  You could make something up with a length of studding, bolts, washers and possibly andold socket or similar.  

If you are in Essex I do have one that was specially made for the task around 30 years ago!

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  • 2 weeks later...

Thanks for the input gents, and for the kind offer mikeyb. In the end I bought a 5lb slide hammer. Finally got down to my lock-up on Sunday. Getting the hammer attached was a bit of a game, then the shaft took a surprising amount of persuasion to come out! Some serious thumps later and it finally let go.

One step forward, one step back though: the shaft is out but the engine still won't separate from the gearbox. I've jacked it up slightly to get the two sump bolts out from the front end, and knocked the two bushes out on the left side like the workshop manual says. But when I lift the block up off it's mounts, the gearbox is coming with it.

Any tips on separating them, without causing irreversible damage??

Thanks again!

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Have you removed the two long bolts that go up through the sump/gearbox casting into the rear of the engine?.
These have to be removed from underneath and are often missed as the heads get covered in oil and muck. Look out for the o rings that are under the heads of the bolts when you remove them.

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Quoted from Merl1300
Have you removed the two long bolts that go up through the sump/gearbox casting into the rear of the engine?.
These have to be removed from underneath and are often missed as the heads get covered in oil and muck. Look out for the o rings that are under the heads of the bolts when you remove them.


Spot on Merl! Engine is now separated from gearbox, thank you very much. Turns out I'll be needing an engine crane... embarrassingly I wondered if I might be able to handle it out (with all ancillaries removed) standing on the suspension turrets. After trying, I conclude it isn't and I'm a fool.

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  • 2 months later...

Belated update to this, and of course some more advice needed from the experts:
After much messing about I finally found an engine crane and got the block out about 6 weeks ago. Easy with the right tools eh?!

Am just about to order the uprated gearbox input shaft from Canleys and wondered whether it's worth buying their 25-65 large journal camshaft as well, while the block is out? https://www.canleyclassics.com/engine/camshafts

It's a single-carb 1300fwd, so I'm right to think this cam would be an upgrade aren't I? Thinking I could stick twin SU's on it in the future when funds allow, for a bit more poke. It's literally a family runabout so I'm just thinking of very simple mild mods, where it makes sense.


Away from the engine, last time she was mobile there was a definite wheel-speed-dependent clickety clack from the front driver's side. I'm assuming it's the CV joint, and happily enough the previous owner gave me a pair of CV joint outers with the car (a bit like these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TRIUMPH-1300-PAIR-FACTORTY-REBUILT-UNITS-CV-JOINTS-OUTTER-/151829655919).

In order to replace this, do I really need to separate the rubber donut, as instructed in the workshop manual? I wondered if it could be left undisturbed and I could use my new slide hammer to pull the hub, or something. And do I need a special tool to separate the CV joint? Haven't got the manual to hand at the moment but it looked an intimidatingly awkward job!

Thanks for your time

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The 25/65 cam is the same as fitted to the 1300TC FWD as well as Spitfire Mk3, Vitesse/GT6 Mk2 and many of the 2.5 PIs.  It's a good allrounder and a worthwhile upgrade that will add a bit of extra midrange and top end without really compromising the bottom end and with the addition of twin carbs would bring it to "TC" spec.

Regarding the driveshafts/CVs, it's been a very long time since I messed with a FWD but I would also tend to avoid messing with the rotoflexes unless I really had to - the bolts can be difficult to get out due to corrosion.

If you have a ball joint splitter (the press type ones with a bolt are pretty reasonable) then I'd be inclined to unbolt the brake caliper and tie it up out of the way and then slacken the hub nut before popping the ball joints off (they may even just unbolt from the wishbones, I forget?).  Next you'll need a decent three-legged puller to push the CV out of the hub.  Once that's done you should be able to set the hub and vertical link to one side and tackle the CV, which should come off the shaft with a bit of a clout (Think there are only sprung snap rings holding them).  I've a feeling that if you want to remove the whole driveshaft you are back to taking the doughnut apart 'cause it won't go through the hole in the subframe?

As and aside, it's perfectly possible to dismantle the CV joints, clean everything up, inspect the balls and trackways, and if all looks good, just reassemble with fresh grease.  If the balls and trackways are smooth and unpitted there's avery good chance they'll be fine, especially if the old grease had dried out.

Good luck....

Nick

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I'm also trying to split a gearbox from a 1500 engine. It's all hanging off the hoist and I've removed 12 bolts plus the 2 through the dowels on the left side but it's stuck solid. The input shaft is out. The Haynes book says remove 13 plus the 2 dowelled bolts but I can only find 12. It's been siliconed together in the past but it's so tight it appears to be still bolted but I can't find the elusive 13th bolt that Haynes says is there. I've tried using a big wooden drift and lump hammer on the dipstick boss. I've tried to crack it with a sharp chisel but as there's no give at all I'm reluctant to keep hitting. So are there 12 bolts plus 2 dowelled or 13 plus 2. I've got the dowels out by the way. It may just be the silicone but it's unbelievably tight.this is as tightly stuck as when the bolts were still in. If I didn't know better I'd say it was bolted under the flywheel. Thanks in advance

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I've solved it, the bolts I'd not taken out were the 2 long ones going up through the sump into the bottom of the rear block flange by the rear crank seal. Haynes doesn't mention these in the section describing separating the engine and box, and mine were hidden under a layer of grime.

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Hi Pete,

Yes it's perfectly possible to change the cv joints without undoing the rotoflex couplings, Just as Nick said you just need to unbolt top and bottom ball joints there's no need to spilt the tapers. then push out the cv joint with either a 3 leg puller or the Spitfire/Herald rear hub puller if you have access to one. The cv comes off the shaft with a sharp whack with a large copper mallet.

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