Matt306 Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 A few years back i acquired my very rotten 1970 Herald 13/60. The drivers door was beyond saving and so i salvaged the locks winder and glass and binned the rest. I found a Vitesse door but it has a different lock mechanism and also a the screw at the front edge for securing the quarter light is not recessed under a plug. The door doesn't fit quite as well either.... is there any difference between herald/vitesse doors apart from the lock mechanism?Anyone got a late Herald door near Worcestershire? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Hammond Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 Doors on all but the very earliest of the early Heralds are all the same. Could be that your replacement has been badly reskinned in the past.Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 18, 2015 Author Share Posted July 18, 2015 could be or perhaps a very early one. I'll do some photos Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heraldcoupe Posted July 18, 2015 Share Posted July 18, 2015 The door you describe is from a 1959 or 1960 Herald. There were three different patterns of door used during 1959, with the third type lasting into 1960 - this was the last design to have the exposed quarterlight screw, so it predates Vitesse production.The panel fit however shouldn't be affected by a different door type, there was no change in the aperture they're intended to fit. Where in particular are the problems evident?Cheers,Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 18, 2015 Author Share Posted July 18, 2015 Bill you are as ever a fountain of knowledge. The door isnt great, I'll get some pics up to show. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 19, 2015 Author Share Posted July 19, 2015 I cant move the bonnet back any more, nor the door forward. The drivers door shuts (just) but good enough for the MOT. Its 5 years since i got the Herald , I think i am going to bung it in for MOT as is... the remainder will be restored on the road. I know the handbrake is a common failure point but mine seems to hold the car with it on so fingers crossed. Any other common maladies? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heraldcoupe Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 The door looks like it's too far forward already, there should be better clearance between the quarterlight and windscreen frame. Is it possible your bulkhead is too far back? As a rough and dirty measurement, it should measure 800mm between the overrider mounting and the front face of the bulkhead,Cheers,Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 19, 2015 Author Share Posted July 19, 2015 If i could move the bulk head forward the door wouldn't shut. Think the door is pulled as far back as it can go. I'll measure later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Hammond Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Looks like the bulkhead is leaning too far back on the rear mounts, the way to correct this is to use spacers under the rearmost mounts to tilt it forward rather than shifting it forwards. This should open the gap at the top of the A post and reduce the gap at the bottom of the A post/bottom wing area. You will find that the bulkhead settles/sinks with both age and poor realignment of subsequently realigned front outriggers.Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 19, 2015 Author Share Posted July 19, 2015 I think its something to do with having to weld on 6 completely new outriggers 7 if you include the one holding the exhaust up too!When the chassis came the body was welded to the outriggers, when i say welded there wasn't much metal there. So I couldn't do one at a time it was just a case of grind them all off and start again with the workshop manual. With hindsight I think I may have changed a few things such as do some maths and work out the diagonals and make a wooden jig to peg the outriggers. Oh well its done now. I keep my eye out for another chassis as if I can find another I think I will try again with the benefit of hindsight.I have tilted the bulkhead forward to get the door to shut, I cant recall how many penny washers are there, I'll photo it . The other side is a great fit annoyingly!The door does shut so that's important and it might well just be enough to get it through the MOT. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Hammond Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Even taking a good body off a good chassis and refitting it doesn't guarantee great gaps even if they were great before. The meccano nature of these car's construction means a lot of washers, wedges and packing pieces have to be used in the build up of the body and chassis assembly. Persevere and you'll get it right, some cars have loads of washers on one side and none on the other etc it's normal.M. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 19, 2015 Author Share Posted July 19, 2015 The most annoying is, i cant shift the bonnet back (its at it limit) or the door forward (it catches on the screen or doesn't shut) i am at a loss for the theory of where to shove washers to close that up Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heraldcoupe Posted July 19, 2015 Share Posted July 19, 2015 Quoted from pigboy306 The most annoying is, i cant shift the bonnet back (its at it limit) or the door forward (it catches on the screen or doesn't shut) i am at a loss for the theory of where to shove washers to close that up Check that 800mm measurement I gave you earlier between the bulkhead to overrider brackets. There are fixes, but we need to know where the problem lies before making recommendations.Cheers,Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 20, 2015 Author Share Posted July 20, 2015 Checked this morning its around 795mm so a little to far forward which should make that bonnet gap small not large. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heraldcoupe Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 795mm is certainly wrong, but as you've said, correcting it will move things the wrong way. The alignment between bonnet top and bulkhead doesn't look bad in the photos, but I'll take your word for it that it's worse than it appears. To move the bonnet rearwards, it's been common to make extended bonnet attachment links (121254). It's a simple flat plate with two holes, one of them elongated into a slot, I believe longer versions have been offered on ebay in the past.There is also mileage in tilting the bulkhead as already mentioned, but ensure your roof will fit correctly before fixing in a revised position.Cheers,Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 20, 2015 Author Share Posted July 20, 2015 I have no roof at the moment so no worries there. I think i took the datum line too far forward on the technical drawing. This has been a learning curve... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 20, 2015 Author Share Posted July 20, 2015 I asked on TSSC forum when I was on the rebuild and was advised the rear face of the front cross member was the datum line, I have since learnt this was the too far forward I think its the bolts on the uprights isn't it? Feel free to refer to my diagram where I have marked several points.I think I have pulled the whole gubbins forward by about 5-10mm which is blooming annoying. I have it all bolted down though which is a bonus and the doors close. I think my winter project will be stripping the out riggers off but this time using a wooden framed jig I think. I guess the cost will be some paint , and skin off my knuckles and new fuel and brake lines. Ho hum... unless someone has a better idea?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
heraldcoupe Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 Quoted from pigboy306 I asked on TSSC forum when I was on the rebuild and was advised the rear face of the front cross member was the datum line, I have since learnt this was the too far forward I think its the bolts on the uprights isn't it? Feel free to refer to my diagram where I have marked several points. Point 'd' is correct for the front datum. As a sanity check, the rear datum is a vertical line through the back face of the rear damper mounting point, the horizontal distance between both points measuring 242.42cm to 243.05cm. Cheers,Bill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 20, 2015 Author Share Posted July 20, 2015 Yep that will put me about 5-10mm to far forward on the bulkhead and other mounts. I guess i can grind off the welds and weld them back on. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve AKA vitessesteve Posted July 20, 2015 Share Posted July 20, 2015 Have you seen this blog post: http://vitessesteve.blogspot.co.uk/2015/05/fitting-vitesse-body-to-chassis.html which includes a detailed diagram of what shape the chassis should be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Matt306 Posted July 21, 2015 Author Share Posted July 21, 2015 No i hadnt but i will read now Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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