vitesse doors - the saga continues

[astrab00y]

ive had to strip the drivers side door down on my vitesse so i can get the cracked glass out so i can replace it, it was a nightmare of a job but i managed to get the glass out eventually and await delivery of new glass and other parts.

so whilst the door was stripped i decided to work out why the bottom rear and bottom front of the door sticks out when shut, the front sticks out about 5mm and the rear sticks out about 15mm, so i decided to remove the weather strip from around the door and it shuts fine at the rear but still sticks out at the front, so how do i go about lining up the door properly, any suggestions

[ferny]

These might help you;

http://club.triumph.org.uk/cgi-bin/forum/Blah.pl?b-hervit/m-1200960059/s-all/

http://club.triumph.org.uk/cgi-bin/forum/Blah.pl?m-1171750387/s-7/

[Dale]

Bill Davies at Rarebits does by far the best section door seal which will help with the problem at the back but I fear the real problem is likely to be the old 'Reskinned doors' ploy, whereby it wasn't reskinned to the car but off it without trial refitting at certain key stages.   :B
It's also possible that it isn't the original door and without reskinning it you may not get it right ever.   :'(
It would be worth trying to adjust the front IN on the hinges tho', there is some adjustment there to be had and the lip where the aperture seal sits can always be 'persuaded in' with a rubber mallet or club hammer and wood if reqd. to give just that little bit more clearance.

Good Luck !  ::)

[heraldcoupe]

Kicking out at the back is usually down to body tub spread, problems at the front are far more likely to be distorted doors. Are you aligning to the sill, or the the bonnet/rear shell? The sill is the most reliable edge to align against,
Cheers,
Bill.

[astrab00y]

to be honest the door at the front lines up quite well with the sill until u run your hand towards the rear and you can feelthe door sticking out, i was hoping to try and do something with the bonnet so when i lock it down it pulls it out slighly which would then make the front of the door look level, as with the rear im relectung to start manipulating the body tub, i have a feeling i can get it all the line up right by doing something with the door seal, because when i take that off the door lines up and shutts nicely, is there any other rubber seals i can use which arent so thick

[heraldcoupe]

astrab00y wrote:

is there any other rubber seals i can use which arent so thick

Well I try not to blow my own trumpet, but my seals have been recommended further up this thread.....
Cheers,
Bill.

[astrab00y]

right ive had a go at fitting the new door glass and of course it ended up in a slanging match with the car, as a matter of fact the swearing got soo bad my neighbour came round to see if everything was ok.

so, the problem now is that the glass is touching the front channel and the rear of the door and this is without any channel seals in, i cant understand why its doing this, i tried to move the quarterlight back but the door wont shut because its hitting the front windscreen, im assuming the glass is correct because it came out of a vitesse,
any suggestions

[Dale]

Although you don't say so I bet your Vit is a convertible, if not you've got REALLY major problems. What happens is that, over time the screen pillars weaken and believe it or not the tension of the hood pulls the top of the screen frame back and can also cause the bulkhead to creep backwards toward the rear tub while the rear tub 'relaxes' towards the bulkhead.
   This then makes the top of the 1/4 light frame hit the screen pillar so someone moves the door back a bit. It then clears the front but leaves no gap at the back.
   Next time the only adjustment left is to move the 1/4 light frame back. You then have a very tight door and drop glass, and if someone reskins it to fit the gap or whatever no space at all for the glass.
   The probable fix here is to move the 1/4 light frame forwards so that the glass goes up & down OK, then move the bulkhead forwards from the tub (much, much, much easier said than done!)   :'(  until you have an acceptable gap.
   Main probs you're likely to find are 1) bulkhead/tub bolts won't come undone or do up again after, 2) there's a wee bit of tin-worm about which means that it all flexes but won't stay moved or worse 3) falls apart.
   Should you encounter 3) I advise a set of ear muffs for your neighbour and a large quantity of beer for you!   ;D
   Good Luck mate, we've all been there!   ;)

[astrab00y]

thanks for your advice dale, ive cooled down now and had another look at the door after work, i stupidly didnt measure the original glass and the new glass, it appears that the new glass is out of a totally different car because its 10mm too wide and 10mm too short on the bend, its pissed me off abit cuz the bloke assured me it was out of a vitesse and with a stag and a herald in his garage i assumed he knew what he was doing. oh well, so another problem has arose, ive took the winder mechanism out to try and find out why its not winding up but i couldnt work out how it works but il have another look at that tommorow after a trip to canleys for some door glass lol

anyway im off to get that large quantity of beer

[astrab00y]

ive now learnt thanks to advice from canleys that the door glass used by the PO was laminated glass which has been cut to size to get the coreect fitting.

so now ive put the correct glass in, the door wont shut because the quarterlight hits the front windcreen, ive tried adjusting the door but ive had no luck.
im pressuming that body tub spread is the cause as dale suggested.

so now my only options now are:

1)to get toughened glass cut to size so it gives the correct fit which will cost many weeks of pocket money
2) to pull the winscreen forward so i can use the original glass and allow the quartlight to stop fouling the windscreen pillar. it only needs to come forward about 5 - 7 mm
personally i would like to use the original glass but how do i go about moving the front windscreen forwards.

ta
mart

[Steve Cureton]

Astra Boy, I had a similar problem when I swapped some doors recently even though I used the same quater light frame. It turned out to just a little adjustment of teh quater light frame was required, 10 minutes fiddling had it sorted. In case you don't know there is a hidden scew in the edge of the door frame underneath a grommet. The others can be accessed by removing the door card, justslacken everything off and hopefully you wil be able to gain the gap you need.

[junkuser]

Toughened cannot be cut.  That is why laminated was used.

[astrab00y]

ur right steve, the screw on the outside of the quarterlight doesnt really play any part on my door because the qaurtelight is set to its lowest and still hits the winscreen, this is why i need to pull the windscreen back so i can get it all to fit.

junkuser i was contemplating on getting laminated glass and having it cut to size but its going to cost a lot to have it done so my idea is to keep the original triumph glass and get it to fit ideally.

[Steve Cureton]

I'd be inclined to fix the problem with the frame, I'd like to be sure the problem isn't caused by corrosion of damage otherwise you could be back to square one at some point in the future.

[astrab00y]

i dont think its corrosion steve but then again i dont know where im meant to be looking, ive seen comment on packing the bulkhead bolts so the bulkhead is pushed further out which seem like a good idea but i dont even know where the bulkhead bolts are and whether this is a job too much for my limited knowledge

[Clive]

The bulkhead is attached by a bolt either side in the engine bay, and by another bolt (or 2 from memory) through the siderail (behind the sill) These long bolts often seize as they are often untouched for years if ever. An angle grinder will do the job though! you need to cut through the gap between the sill and body mounting bracket. You can then add some washers to the mounting neareset the middle of the car to tilt the bulkhead. It may need 1/4" to do the trick. New bolts and nuts etc needed obviously. Not difficult, but a bit of a fiddle. Still the doorglass is worse and you have done that!

If you haven't got a grinder they are essential bits of kit (ideally with a full face mask) and not expensive either.

Clive

[bxbodger]

It took me ages to set my doors up properly- after pulling in the rear of the tub the doors sat flush with the rear wings but I still had a problem of the quarter-lights pushing on the screen surround.....the bulkhead mounts were free from corrosion and didn't look as if they'd collapsed or moved or been badly replaced in the past (which can all cause the bulkhead to sit at the wrong angle) so I couldn't figure out why and was contemplating adjusting the bulkhead angle until I ran a feeler gauge up between the quarterlight and the screen surround, and found that they weren't touching all the way up, only at certain parts.......It turned out to be the result of a previous owner badly replacing rusty drain channels at the side of the screen.

Instead of cutting away all trace of the old ones, the lip only was cut off and the repair sections welded over the top of the old ones...which had swelled with corrosion. This meant that the back of the screen surround was touching on the quarter lights.This gave the appearance of an out of line bulkhead/door/quarterlight but wasn't....so have a look at the screen surround before adjusting the bulkhead, and make sure it's not the bulkhead mounts that are collapsing.    

[Pete Lewis]

there are 2 body bolts you see in front of the baulk head are on metal spacers and do not allow fore aft movement, the remaining body bolts go thro metal stand offs welded to the floor above the chassis side rails,  and above the diff   these are all packable to raise or lower the tubs, theres's a fair chance that they will resist removal due to rust, the bolts go through a tube welded in the rail.  Any amount of steel packes/washers can be used to alter the height and you can tip the baulhead to get more A post clearance,, DO NOT use more than 1 rubber spacer at each bolt,, do a ' Search' for body tub spread there are ways of pulling it in,, but it needs a lot of effort  but does correct doors tight on the waist seal and proud at the bottom,,    there loads of advice available  but stay methodical the results can be exciting    or    awfull    have fun   Peter