Vitesse Mk1 Heater Hose Plumbing

[Jason C]

Hi folks,

Wondering if anyone would be so kind to offer guidance on the correct heater plumbing set-up for a Vitesse, 2 Litre, Mark1, 1968. 

I am in the middle of putting the cylinder head back together after fixing a head gasket. I have pushed hoses into what I think are the correct positions on the three way, manifold adaptor pipe:

1. Top adaptor pipe – to heater valve.
2. Centre adaptor pipe – to heater outlet pipe.
3. Bottom adaptor pipe – to rubber hose, to stainless return pipe, that connects to water pump.

There is a brass hose fitting coming from the bottom side of the cylinder head. I believe this is incorrect? The engine number is: HC10398E – should it have a blanking plug to close this off? Perhaps this is intended for a drain plug, or the cylinder head was used for another engine, and blanked off for the Vitesse.

Are the hoses connected correctly? Are the hoses themselves correct? The rubber hose to the thermostat housing seems too long by my eye for starters.

Please ignore the additional temporary washer in front of the adaptor, the thread in the alloy manifold is past its best. It will not thread any further, has someone had success re-tapping the aluminium thread on the manifold, or safest to use a washer packer, with fibre washers in-between? There seems to be enough thread inside to provide a firm grip. Also, what is an effective thread sealant to apply to the aluminium thread on the manifold, and the water pump fittings? Thread tape, hemp, Loctite thread sealant 567, Hylomar Blue?

Thank you for any help.

Best, Jason

[RobPearce]

I think your hoses on the heater end are correct. The extra brass tapping should be replaced with a plug as in the exploded diagram. Some early cars had heater hoses direct from the head so that's probably a Vanguard 6 fitment (or very early 2000 saloon?)

For the front hose, have you tried turning it round? It looks like the two ends are different lengths and it might well fit better with the long end on the manifold.

[Rutty]

The heater hoses are connected the same as my Mk1 2L. The front hose is a little bit to long if it worries you then cut a bit off the end. Mine has a blanking plug on the head.

[Jason C]

3 hours ago, RobPearce said:

I think your hoses on the heater end are correct. The extra brass tapping should be replaced with a plug as in the exploded diagram. Some early cars had heater hoses direct from the head so that's probably a Vanguard 6 fitment (or very early 2000 saloon?)

For the front hose, have you tried turning it round? It looks like the two ends are different lengths and it might well fit better with the long end on the manifold.

Thanks @RobPearce most appreciated, will replace the brass pipe with a plug. I’ll admit it caused some confusion having the extra hose, so thats a relief. The previous owner had a short rubber hose attached with a bung in the end, which made me curious. Could the hole in the block have served any practical use, like draining? Or like you say an appendage from the past. Will try turning the hose around, nice and simple, but I still didn't think of it myself. 🙂 

 

[Jason C]

58 minutes ago, Rutty said:

The heater hoses are connected the same as my Mk1 2L. The front hose is a little bit to long if it worries you then cut a bit off the end. Mine has a blanking plug on the head.

Thanks @Rutty thats perfect! Appreciate the photos, made life nice and easy. Your images sparked my curiosity, what are the plates on the manifold between the carbs, some type of heat deflector? 

[Jason C]

A heating related question, the heater valve – mine is very hard to pull in the cabin, pulling the wooden dash when operating. Is this due to not being adjusted incorrectly, or do I need to lubricate the cable? Anyone encountered this and have a remedy? The valve itself it relatively new, well 5 years or so.

[Rutty]

Hi Jason 

Yes they are heat shields to try and stop the hot exhaust vaporising the fuel in the carbs when the engine is stopped. This is why it can take a good few seconds of cranking to start the engine even when hot as the bowls on the carbs need to be refilled. To be honest I don't think they make much difference. 

Mark 

[glang]

As a small aside, I would really recommend using a clear pipe for the radiator overflow (doesnt need to be a pressure pipe but must be able to withstand a vacuum) as then you can easily spot the first sign of trouble if the pipe isnt constantly full of coolant👍

[RobPearce]

4 hours ago, Jason C said:

A heating related question, the heater valve – mine is very hard to pull in the cabin, pulling the wooden dash when operating. Is this due to not being adjusted incorrectly, or do I need to lubricate the cable? Anyone encountered this and have a remedy? The valve itself it relatively new, well 5 years or so.

They often are very stiff but it's usually the cable more than the valve itself. The inner rusts to the outer. Lubrication requires you to pull the inner through and then refit, which can be a pain, otherwise the oil doesn't get distributed well enough. Take the opportunity to clean the inner cable up.

People sometimes suggest replacing with a bike brake cable, with the PTFE liner and flexible inner. That's all very well for accelerator and choke cables, but the heater cable operates in push as much as pull, and therefore needs to have the solid inner.

While it's disconnected, check that the valve itself is not ceased up. They can get pretty solid even if only a few years old.

[Jason C]

11 hours ago, Rutty said:

Yes they are heat shields to try and stop the hot exhaust vaporising the fuel in the carbs when the engine is stopped. This is why it can take a good few seconds of cranking to start the engine even when hot as the bowls on the carbs need to be refilled. To be honest I don't think they make much difference.

Thanks @Rutty most interesting. I have seen larger heat shields and always wondered what they are designed for. I haven’t driven my Vitesse much yet (need to get running first!), is fuel vaporising a common issue with all carb engines? Do people have other solutions to help smoothen or just a fact of life with older engines? In another thread folks mentioned using larger fuel line from the tank helps reduce vaporisation.

[Jason C]

9 hours ago, RobPearce said:

They often are very stiff but it's usually the cable more than the valve itself. The inner rusts to the outer. Lubrication requires you to pull the inner through and then refit, which can be a pain, otherwise the oil doesn't get distributed well enough. Take the opportunity to clean the inner cable up.

People sometimes suggest replacing with a bike brake cable, with the PTFE liner and flexible inner. That's all very well for accelerator and choke cables, but the heater cable operates in push as much as pull, and therefore needs to have the solid inner.

While it's disconnected, check that the valve itself is not ceased up. They can get pretty solid even if only a few years old.

Awesome, thank you @RobPearce for the detailed help. Will flush the valve, remove and lubricate the cable. I’ve noticed the O-ring on the valve has perished, so on the to do list.

[Jason C]

Thanks everyone for the help on the heater plumbing. Spent today cleaning the Smiths heater, removed and flushed the radiator and valve. Cleaned the cables with compressed air, and applied some Teflon dry glide inside the cables. Cleaned the heater mechanism flap, hopefully once assembled it will be smooth operating. 🙂

[Jason C]

A follow up question – brass or steel blanking plug in the cylinder block? Does it make a big difference for corrosion (removal if needed later) if the head is steel? Any preference, experience over the long term for plumbing tape on threads vs Loctite thread sealant?

[RobPearce]

The head blanking plug never needs to come out unless you're having major head machining done. I'm fairly sure the factory fitted steel ones, and probably with no sealant. It's the same plug as the sump drain, I suspect.

[Jason C]

Thanks @RobPearce sounds spot on. 👍