Enviromental Zones in Europe

[Howard]

During the last 10CR we encountered these zones for the first time around Lille, but this time they are much more of an issue. While we should be OK for most of Europe cars made before 1993 cannot pass through any green zones inside Germany at any time!

There are 58 zones in Germany that our cars are forbidden from using, which include most of the major cities and many main routes.

While I am certain that Ellis & Co. will have taken care of this in preparing the recommended route, it is common to take faster/shorter routes cuts to catch up. In these cases you need to be very aware of the risks of entering a restricted zone by accident.

Further details can be obtained from Green-zones.eu

 

 

 

 

 

[Don Cook]

HHmmmmmm. First glance at the maps, it seems that Augsburg is a green-zone including the road my hotel is on! However, are our cars exempt in the countries we are travelling in, it seems so...but...???  

Found this:-

"The Environmental Zone

General Exemptions from Driving Ban in Germany

 

The following vehicles are exempt from the traffic bans in environmental zones in accordance with Annexe 3 of the Marking Ordinance (35th Ordinance for the implementation of the Federal Immission Protection Act). They may be driven without a sticker or with any sticker in all environmental zones in Germany.

1. Mobile engines and equipment,
   
   
2. Working machinery,
   
   
3. Agricultural and forestry tractors,
   
   
4. Two- or three-wheeled vehicles,
   
   
5. Ambulances, emergency medical cars with the sign "Arzt Notfalleinsatz"
   
   
6. Vehicles driven by or with people suffering from impaired mobility or who are severely disabled or blind whose severe disability pass contains the codes "aG", "H" or "Bl" in accordance with the Severely Disabled Persons Pass Ordinance,
   
   
7. Vehicles for which the special rights according to Article 35 of the German Traffic Regulations (StVO) can be called on,
   
   
8. Vehicles of foreign military personnel from non-NATO countries who are in Germany for the purpose of collaboration provided their vehicles are being used for urgent military reasons,
   
   
9. Civilian vehicles used on behalf of the Federal German military forces involving journeys in fulfillment of official duties of the German military forces that cannot be postponed,
   
   
10. Vintage cars (in accordance with Article 2 section 22 of the vehicle registration regulation) which bear a registration number in accordance with Article 9 Section 1 or Article 17 of the vehicle registration regulations as well as vehicles which are licensed in a European Union member state, in another contracting party of the treaty concerning the European Economic Area or in Turkey provided they fulfil equivalent requirement."

 

On a site called Classics World (Nov 2018) I found this:-

"Historic exemption

So if you own an older car in Spain or France, are you out in the cold? In Spain it seems that way, as there are no exceptions for historic vehicles. In Paris, cars over 30 years old are allowed in providing they can prove their ‘oldtimer’ status, but this exception is not universal. We contacted the French government for clarification and we’re told to contact the city hall of the different cities to find out if historic cars were exempt. That’s not exactly straightforward for someone planning a holiday, especially if it involves multiple areas.

What about other countries? In Germany, where there are now over 70 environmental zones, things are clearer. These operate using the system of green, yellow and red, which require a corresponding coloured sticker for entry. Foreign cars over 30 years old are exempt as long as they are largely unmodified, and are well-maintained. We’ve also heard of cases where special dispensation for younger vehicles is allowed.

In Belgium, things look rosier for classics too, albeit not consistent. Antwerp and Brussels are the only cities affected so far, though more will follow. In Antwerp, cars meeting a minimum of Euro 1 for petrol and Euro 3 (with particulate filter) for diesel are permitted, while only diesels below Euro 2 standards are excluded in Brussels, but regulations for both cities will tighten in 2020. Foreign historic vehicles can be registered for a three-year exemption for Brussels when they are over 30 years old, and for concessions in Antwerp when over 40. In both cities, it’s possible to buy a pass for eight individual days a year if your car doesn’t meet the standards.

Italy, meanwhile, has no national scheme, but many different low emission zones with differing standards and time periods. Most have exemption for historic vehicles of over 30 years old, but rules and regulations vary by region and municipality. Our advice here would be to use public transport for central areas, if only for your stress levels!"

 

 

 

[richard w]

Thanks Howard. I think we might have a problem in Augsburg. Our hotel is within the restricted zone, which is active at the moment. Might have to think about looking for another one outside the exclusion area. Also the restart on Saturday 7th probably needs to be outside it too.

[Howard]

In short the LEZ is a total mess across Europe. No consistency between cities let alone countries & no clear maps available to assist in avoiding the zones.

Ignoring the minefield of what is a classic (in European law!), basically as far as I can see the only way to be safe is to install the Green-Zones app on your phone, enter the details of your car & check if the zone is shown as green or red as you approach each zone then modify your route accordingly.

Once the route is finalised I will try and download all the LEZ maps near our route and compile them into a single PDF file that can be printed for reference.

 

 

[Don Cook]

If confirmation of what is a classic and if it is exempt in the countries/cities visited then we shouldn't have to worry about Environmental Zones.

So, in Germany:  "Foreign cars over 30 years old are exempt as long as they are largely unmodified, and are well-maintained."

I'm hanging on to my Augsburg booking for a while yet.

[Howard]

Don,

Plenty of the CT cars have been modified to the extent that they cannot be considered as largely unmodified eg Zetec engined GT6... Also from my reading of the various discussions of what constitutes a largely original car in some EU countries, if its not the original part, or at least a NOS part it doesn't qualify.

Cheers

H

 

 

 

[richard w]

This is the site I found which worried me

https://www.umwelt-plakette.de/en/information-about-german-environmental-badge/the-german-environmental-badge/no-german-environmental-badge-entry-bans.html

If I'm reading it correctly (which I might not!) it's saying that we cannot get an environmental badge for our cars as they were first registered before 01/01/93. This therefore means that we won't be able to drive into the Augsburg Green Zone if the restrictions are in place - which they have been all day today.

I've now cancelled our Ibis Augsburg booking and booked another hotel outside the zone.  Maybe I've jumped the gun a bit, but it's done now and I don't fancy reversing it all yet again!

[Clive]

Re modifications. I can't imagine the local police (or whoever enforces the rules) wanting to pull an old car over and try to explain what is "the problem". Let alone want to inspect th ecar for modifications.

Besides, the modifications thing may be applied according to country of registration? My car certainly looks standard.😉

BUT I fully expect the organisers to take all these issues into account, and no doubt will issue guidance.

[Howard]

If you look at this site you will see that petrol cars from before 1993 cannot get a german ECO badge, so are not allowed in LEZ zones at any time of day or night:-

https://www.umwelt-plakette.de/en/information-about-german-environmental-badge/the-german-environmental-badge/who-can-obtain-the-german-environmental-badge.html

The limited exceptions are specified on the this page:-

https://www.umwelt-plakette.de/en/information-about-german-environmental-badge/environmental-zones-in-germany/exceptions-rules.html

"Antique cars distinguished with the mention “H” on the registration plate, in accordance with the prescriptions of the paragraph §9-1 and §17 of the German directive on the vehicles registration or Vehicles from en other EU member state or from an member state of the European Economic Area or from Turkey responding to the above-mentioned requirements"

which is all well and good except that the UK doesn't have any corresponding directives...

 

 

 

[Clive]

Historic taxation class? It says that on the V5 so should be evidence enough.

And I think we are supposed to carry our V5 when visiting Europe. 

 

[Saltddirk]

Be careful in Antwerp, the rule is that your car needs to be older than 40 years (date of first registration) before you can enter, however people have been fined and our national federation advises everybody to first pay and then dispute! You also need to buy a "pass" to be allowed in the zone, which for +40 is 20 euro's for a week ( and you can not buy a daypass for these)

For Brussels a car registered as Historical vehicle, in Belgium these are registered with a "O" registration and more than 30 years old are allowed in, No mention of foreign registered cars.

As the scanning is done with APR camera's the registration is compared automatically with the database, in case of foreign cars this needs to be done manually, so chances are that i) they just consider it too much hassle and forget about it or ii) they consider it too much hassle to check and just fine you, up to you to prove that you were allowed in....

You still can take the ring road in Brussels and Antwerp as they fall outside the LEZ.

For Germany I was under the impression that cars older than '96 are allowed in without a sticker.... 

Dirk

 

[Saltddirk]

Quoted from Saltddirk-

For Germany I was under the impression that cars older than '96 are allowed in without a sticker.... 

Dirk

 

Forget what I said about Germany, that's wrong, more study needed....

D

[GTRoger]

Don't think you have to worry too much about the German enviromental zones,as far as I am aware of, the 10CR route will never cross one of these zones. The only exception is Augsburg, though you should be fine as long as you stay away from the city centre. So, be careful when booking accomodation in the Augsburg city centre. 

[Don Cook]

Hey fellas. This is the third time this exemption for Germany has been put on here!

1. Vintage cars (in accordance with Article 2 section 22 of the vehicle registration regulation) which bear a registration number in accordance with Article 9 Section 1 or Article 17 of the vehicle registration regulations as well as vehicles which are licensed in a European Union member state, in another contracting party of the treaty concerning the European Economic Area or in Turkey provided they fulfil equivalent requirement."

[Rosbif]

Quoted from Don Cook-

Hey fellas. This is the third time this exemption for Germany has been put on here!

1. Vintage cars (in accordance with Article 2 section 22 of the vehicle registration regulation) which bear a registration number in accordance with Article 9 Section 1 or Article 17 of the vehicle registration regulations as well as vehicles which are licensed in a European Union member state, in another contracting party of the treaty concerning the European Economic Area or in Turkey provided they fulfil equivalent requirement."

All fine then? Ah, but what if? What if at the end of March the UK does a no deal Brexit?

The  UK is out of the EU and in consequence out of the EEA that leaves you subject to the ban. Cross your fingers that there is a deal. If there isn't the German police might just say "an old car let it go" OR they might take the view " look a Brit in an old car let's get them!"

I'm sure it will be ok

[Dannyb]

Achtung Spitfire

[Rosbif]

Quoted from Dannyb-

Achtung Spitfire

You old Fokker !

[Saltddirk]

on a lighter note....

 

I'll get my coat :)

D

[Tim Hunt]

Love it Dirk!🙂

Tim

[Rosbif]

Quoted from Tim Hunt-

Love it Dirk!🙂

Tim

Another thumbs up

[Beans]

The Green Zones app might be useful 

https://www.green-zones.eu/nl.html

[Tim Hunt]

That's all very well Theo, except for us old codgers who have so far resisted a smart phone, there won't be one in Car 49. I booked a hotel outside the Augsburg Umwelt, which is handy for J74a A8 on the Saturday morning. However, we are approaching Augsburg from due South of course so I looked for a map of the Zone to plot a route round it to our hotel. I could not find such a map with sufficient detail. I found a list of roads forming the N,S, E and W boundaries of the Zone but could not find them all on any map!  

I called the hotel to see if they could provide me with a link but no joy. The lady I spoke to said her son was into classic cars and he told her that 'old timers' could drive through the city with no sticker without problems. However, I am not happy that this would apply to a UK registered car, even in the 'Historic' taxation class and no matter how original. I won't be taking a chance and will just drive round the south east of the city avoiding passing any Umwelt signs into the Zone. 

Of course if Howard is able to find a suitably large scale Augsburg L.E. Zone map in printable format that would be great.

Tim

[Don Cook]

I have printed a 9 page document called:-

Thirty-fifth ordinance of the implementation of the Federal Immission Control Act.

The last page, last annexe states that our classic "oldtimers" (assuming Tax/MOT exempt vehicles in the UK), as we are still in the EU, are not required to show a relevant sticker as they are exempt.

See previous post for a translation of the relevant part.

 

 

 

[Greta]

Quoted from Don Cook-

I have printed a 9 page document called:-

Thirty-fifth ordinance of the implementation of the Federal Immission Control Act.

The last page, last annexe states that our classic "oldtimers" (assuming Tax/MOT exempt vehicles in the UK), as we are still in the EU, are not required to show a relevant sticker as they are exempt.

See previous post for a translation of the relevant part.

 

 

BRILLIANT - Thanks Don - That'll save at least one Spitfire ( flying in on a wing & a pray ) avoiding being taken prisoner in Augsberg!

 

[Howard]

Quoted from Tim Hunt-

Of course if Howard is able to find a suitably large scale Augsburg L.E. Zone map in printable format that would be great.

Hope this helps

H