efp
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Everything posted by efp
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Interesting chaps, thanks. With some trepidation I’m off to darkest Telford tomorrow to pick it up, but circumstances dictate I won’t have time to give it a good check over for some time. I will report back if and when I do. I say that because on one level it’s like buying a bottle of fine old vintage wine: the only way to know if it’s any good is to open it, but by doing so you destroy it’s scarcity value, and a factory fresh 0 mile engine is up there with the rarest Chateau Lafittes in my book. I may well just leave it untouched in a cool dark place in my cellar. I note all your comments, and yes, of course it’s something of a gamble but, going only on the pictures supplied, the Unipart labels, it’s provenance and the sticker indicating it’s filled with a sealant / inhibibitor give me hope it’s been well rebuilt and well preserved. No warranty has been discussed, nor in all fairness would I really expect one on such an antique, untouched in its shipping crate for 40 plus years. Fully accept it’s a case of caveat emptor, but fingers crossed. Worst case scenario I could break it for parts and probably more than make my money back
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Incidentally, re my second post, obviously I meant unfavoured rather than autocorrect’s “unflavoured”. Though not sure I find that gold paint job very tasteful. It is at least mint.. (groan, sorry..) Believe the FH number indicates its the later large crank variant which I understand aren’t as desired by the competitive, but for a granny driver like me it will do fine. In fact, other than checking it over I think it will probably stay cased and filled with its anti corrosion fluids until I actually need it. Suggestions as to what checks I could make on such a 30+ year old unused engine without actually starting it or dismantling too much would be welcomed
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Thanks Nick, I hear what you are saying. Hope to pick it up next week, will report back.
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Well, it’s in a fitted shipping crate stencilled Gold seal genuine factory replacement unit, and Worn Unit to be Returned in this case, all apertures are masked over and covered with the same gold paint as the rest of the engine, and there are a bunch of Unipart labels, regarding such things as a reminder to retorque the head, , and advice the This engine contains a sealant and inhibitor, Do Not Flush. I’m pretty confident it’s the real deal. Doubt TD Fitchett would play games.
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Curious as to the total lack of reaction to this. Is it because you all think me a complete dick for blowing a grand on an unflavoured engine variant ? Fair enough. But I’d have thought a zero mile motor, effectively NOS, from a reputable vendor, would have been of interest to others too. Looks like I’m wrong then.
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If anyones got too much money left after xmas and fancies a factory reconditioned engine with 0 miles on it, may I draw your attention to this: https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/TRI.....8:gAgAAOSwBkRZ-ewu FH series I think unfortunately, but as I understand it Gold Seal motors were recons hand built to higher standards than production line originals. Seller is Tony Fitchet who says it has been in his stores for 30 years. (Declaration of interest: in a fit of madness I just bought the other one he had available.. Mine won't take another rebore and given the seeming scarcity of good engines, their price, plus the cost of a full recon on what might be a junker, its didn't seem too bad a deal)
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That’s reassuring. On it will go with a bit of grease. Thanks, and a Happy New Year to you all. J
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Damn, duplicated photo and cant work out how to fix. This is the clear side I meant to post
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Hi Ted. Appreciating your input here. Other face is clear and clean as you see. Corrosion is definitely light verdegis from the copper and not rust, is quite greenish. Hardly surprising for a 50 year old part I suppose. A light rub over with 0000 wire wool has cleared most of it, and Im fairly confident(!) there is enough compressible “meat” to seal, I hope. Ive oiled it for now.
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Further thought: wouldn’t a layer of grease as suggested also affect the sealant effect of this coating?
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That’s what I suspected Paul, so also slightly concerned that where there are these bits of corrosion breaking through the lacquer, the seal might be compromised even if polished out. Which was leaning me towards applying a tad of wellseal.. Or am I overthinking this as usual?
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There’s always one...
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Ah. A good thought Dan thanks, something I’d overlooked, but on checking, yes, the gasket is ambidextrous as it were, symmetrical. No clue there.
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A Christmas miracle! Rare unanimity (almost) on a forum post!
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You are quite right Ted, on looking at them again I can see white fibre showing between the layers within the stud holes, all others being rolled over. They appear to be covered in some sort of clear lacquer which has kept them shiny and bright, bar just a few spots of light verdigris here and there. I assume I can lightly polish the green off before fitting? No Front or Top markings on them, just AE320, Made in England and 207930 stamped in. Curiously, the packaging has been hand altered to change the number to 321, but the gaskets are stamped 320. Don’t know if this has any significance. Would the rolled-over flanges be top or bottom would you say? Cheers John
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Copper on both sides Ted, don’t think there’s anything between. I’ve no experience of Payens, other than hearing of them constantly recommended as the best, and long out of production for the 1147, but understood them to be a black composite, so was surprised to find copper which I thought was just used for esoteric racing heads. But these are very old CE421 sets, labelled as being for the Herald 1200 and Couriers, 61-65, though they seem to fit my head perfectly. Water leakage was my problem, so your advice taken on board. Thanks
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Apologies for dragging up an old subject yet again , but I have managed to source a couple of the discontinued 1147 Payen head gaskets , which I understand to be the gold standard, and was slightly surprised to find they are solid copper. Given their apparent scarcity, I don't want to screw them up, and am confused by a lot of conflicting advice over whether or not to use a sealant. Many opinions online: Wellseal, Hematite, copper sealant, grease, etc or nothing at all, but I can't find a definitive answer. Opinions and experiences welcomed?
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Interesting Tim. After how many miles running on unleaded ? But I’d stand by the suggestion of if it ain’t broke, don’t fix it. (As opposed to my usual practice, of if it ain’t broke, fix it until it is...) As a point of reference Mr Spit2, and if you hadn’t already looked, Canley’s do a complete reconditioned head for £285, and you’d know the job had been done right.
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My reply overlapped with Colin’s to the same effect. The unleaded head thing is something of a myth. Unless you have money to burn, I’d humbly suggest that you’ll soon find more pressing areas on a Spit on which those kind of funds can be more urgently be spent.. Welcome to the world of money pit Triumphs.
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This has been discussed oft before, but are you sure you really need to do the work? Do you have low compression? Many of us have run unmodified heads quite happily on unleaded over many years before, if ever, seat erosion make inserts necessary.
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Would just suggest that before cutting them down, check that as much threaded length as possible is within the calliper. I had to take a die to extend the thread back into the plain shank of mine after trimming to length. Another alternative if a few more washers under the bolt head. In any event, I’d suggest a dab of thread lock whatever the torque setting. The threaded depth isn’t huge and you really don’t want them coming loose.
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Sorry, belatedly edited my post to make my point clearer and we overlapped, but I get what you are saying. Thanks Yes, I saw your timing cover posts too, made me laugh Your own contribution to Triumph's patented anti-corrosion system
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lol. But umm.. "IMHO, a venier is a waste of money on a Triumph. How do I know? I have one - I wasted my money. John " Not entirely positive then? But seriously though, ? I can see that unless you are constantly tweaking as a racer, having found the sweet spot you'd never need to use the adjustment again, but wondering how crucial and useful you found it in finding that point. Academic, as I can't afford that investment, but curious. cheers John
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(Stands well back to allow the grown ups to fight it out) JohnD, see a conversation you were involved in back in 2007 in which you were scathing about vernier adjustable cam sprockets and you obviously know your stuff. Alarmed by the amount of stretch I found in a fairly new single chain, despite hours of setting up a new one I've just bitten the bullet on a duplex set, but disturbed to realise they are, in standard form, less adjustable than a single cog as they can't be flipped. Have you changed your opinions on verniers since? I do realise duplex sets are strictly unnecessary on a mere 1147 in standard tune but I may come to up-rate the cam and associated bits in future and seek to future proof it, and besides would like my hard-achieved cam timing to not drift so much as it has, and be more bullet-proof. Or am I over-thinking all this? No plans to race or rally my car, just want to optimise her.
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Not pretending to be an expert here, have just been through this for the first time in many years having read up a lot. Quite prepared to be shot down by those more knowledgeable. I don’t know the specs on a 2.5 Steve, but my little 1147 has a 25/65 symmetric cam, which gives a max inlet open at 110 ATDC which is what I worked from when setting my timing, and I’m guessing is what you mean. I understand Triumph were quite happy with 2-3 degrees or so as acceptable variance, (hence their sprocket punch marks being a bit approximate), but variations either side of optimal have noticeable effects on performance. 4-5 degrees advanced from that will give better low end torque, 4-5 later more higher rev performance. Or is it the the other way round? . Or it all could be complete bollocks that I’ve misunderstood.. Anyway, hence my suggestion to establish a true TDC to work from. While the engine will start and run many degrees outside these parameters, makes sense to me to get maximum accuracy and thus performance out of the engine by getting it right while I have things apart. I say “have” it apart, as having done the job, I found Paddocks have a double chain set up for the 1147 at a fair price so Im going to do it all over again, hoping for better accuracy.