Your roadside, get you home bodges thread - RBRR inspired

[Jason]

I was thinking about this when in the RBRR, there are lots of issues that develop on events like the RBRR, 10CR and in everyday driving that you can fix on the side of the road even though many people think it's terminal.

So I decide to put something together to at least show what can be achieved with just what's' to hand on the side of the road. Things like

• How do I deal with a failed alternator?
• My carb diaphragm has split, that's me out then, isn't it?
• What to do when a fuse blows and you have no spare?
• Kicked your 4 wheel nuts into a ditch in the dark, what now?
• I've just put £30 of diesel in my car, what do I do now?
• Dipped bean has failed, I only have full beam, what can I do?
• The head gaskets blow, there's nothing I can do about that, is there?
• I've got no rear lights, I can't drive like that can I?

So, lets have your tips and tricks, remember be specific as you're not preaching the choir here, this is for the people who don't have the answers, just the questions 🙂 

Edited October 6, 2021 by Jason
fixed teh typo

[Nick Jones]

Ah…… it depends on which car and your mechanical abilities but…..
 

Alternator - I always carry a spare on the long runs and on Small chassis cars it takes about 10 minutes to change.

Carb diaphragm - Carry a spare, or even two or three. They are cheap, small and light. Takes 5 minutes to change one.

If you are doing an event like the RBRR with no spare fuses…… well, you are not even nearly prepared. There’s always aluminium foil to wrap the blown fuse with or even a suitably sized bolt, but the fuse blew for a reason, so you might burn the car down…..

Take one nut each of the other 3 wheels….. good idea to carry some spares. Small, cheap etc…..

Misfuel…… ideally drain and refill with the right stuff, but depending on ratio of misfuelling (£30 is only 20L these days!) you might get away with filling any remaining space with the right stuff. It’ll smoke and pink probably, but if you keep diluting as space is made you likely be ok.

No dipped beam…. Mend it? If it turns out to be the switch and you have no spare then maybe swap the wires at the lights so you have dip working rather than main.

Head gasket on a Spitfire/Dolly Toledo OHV/even 6 pot at a pinch is just about possible as a roadside repair if gasket and tools are available. Motivation likely to be higher if a long way from home (10CR)

No you shouldn’t drive with no working rear lights…. But you could maybe team up with another car to drive behind you to get to a safer/lighter place to investigate and fix.

ISTR that there is a pretty comprehensive guide written on this sort of thing that is sent out to all crews?

Nick

[Jason]

Thanks Nick - these are all real examples of things people have either given up and retired with or have been labelled as 'fatal' yet been solved with what was to hand.

"Carry a spare" is all well and good but I've noticed a growing number of people who either don't or if they do, they haven't the tools of basic know how to actually effect a repair - I love a 'trail fix' as the Yanks say, something finagled together that works well and is safe (ish) fashioned out of stuff from the bottom of the tool bag 🙂

A few more have popped into my head - you have a failed left hand fit alternator and someone gives you a spare right hand fit one - what next?

The wiring issues are often solved properly with knowledge and patience but if you aren't electrically minded but you do have a roll of wire and some determination you can find a live feed, an earth point and direct wire rear lights to be on all the time - better than nowt.

The dipped beam issue I had in mind was cured with a quick plug swapping to give dipped only - took all of 5 mins, amazing how quick you can be at the side of a busy road! A self preservation move that go the car and crew to safety for a more considered investigation and fix.

[Howard]

My spares list includes:-

Hoses / Fan belts / a few lengths of studding with bolts & washers / cable ties of all lengths,

The only thing I have really needed was an alternator on one 10CR, a throttle cable (this was repaired with duck tape and jubilee kits just outside Calais and got us around the rest of that 10CR) & Loctite sealant when my oil pressure switch mount decided to drop oil all over the garage forecourt in Luxembourg.

H

[RobPearce]

Alternator - this is something that happened to me in 2000 - the alternator failed somewhere around Huntingdon and I didn't have a spare. I drove on. Keep the revs up (maybe drop out of overdrive) to give the dying alternator the best chance of balancing the loads. Stay on dip beam and turn the cabin heater fan off - try to minimise drain. Get to the next control - Blyth in our case - and ASK. We got several offers of alternators from other teams and club members who were there spectating. Nick says it's easy on a small chassis car - we were in a Stag, which is the worst car I've ever come across for access to the alternator, but we still managed to swap it in the lorry park.

[JohnD]

Has CT ever collected a list of failed parts on the RBRR (or 10CR)?     It should be anonymised, to spare teams' blushes, but would be a useful guide to what to take as spares.  Rob has been brave to confess, but there's no need.

If the Club hasn't ever done this, may I volunteer to collect the data?    I promise, no names, not at all!   Just PM me with your team number, which will be confidential, what failed, what you did about it, could you continue or was it terminal, plus any other comments?

I'll post the list, of failed parts only, if there are a useful number.

John    

[yorkshire_spam]

Pretty sure the dear departed "statto" (aka Raider) used to post stats on retirements from major events based on model+cause.

2 hours ago, JohnD said:

Has CT ever collected a list of failed parts on the RBRR (or 10CR)?     It should be anonymised, to spare teams' blushes, but would be a useful guide to what to take as spares.  Rob has been brave to confess, but there's no need.

 

[Nick Jones]

7 hours ago, Jason said:

"Carry a spare" is all well and good but I've noticed a growing number of people who either don't or if they do, they haven't the tools of basic know how to actually effect a repair - I love a 'trail fix' as the Yanks say, something finagled together that works well and is safe (ish) fashioned out of stuff from the bottom of the tool bag 🙂

Well yeah, so some personal choice here.  Carry carefully selected spares and tools and aim to be self sufficient as far as possible.  I accept that not all have the skills for this, but actually carrying the spares (alternator, water pump, fan belt, hoses, points, condensor, rotor arm, fuses, bits of wire, connectors, gaffer tape, zip ties, couple of wire coat hangers, even a head gasket or UJ) might mean that you can enlist a roadside garage, AA man or fellow traveller to get you rolling again.  Parts for these cars are not as available as they used to be.  You can't buy points, condenser or coil in Halfords on a Sunday afternoon any more.

Alternatively cross your fingers and carry nothing but a mobile phone and AA card (other recovery companies exist).  

Of course, there is no substitute for using your car regularly, keeping it cared for and getting to know it.

I absolutely agree with you on the Trail Fix btw.  I grew up in various parts of Africa and Dad very much liked a road trip, but spending money on cars... not so much.  Some of our trips were quite eventful mechanically (and occasionally otherwise).  He was mainly a gaffer tape and coat-hangers man (not sure zip ties were invented) but did carry water hoses, fuel hose, ignition parts, instant gasket and basic tools.  My contribution was carving a new carbon rod for the our Peugeot 404 distributor cap from the core of a torch battery.  That saved a long walk in the Kalahari.  Thanks to Wilbur Smith for the idea (though I daresay he borrowed it from somewhere else)

Nick

[JohnD]

31 minutes ago, yorkshire_spam said:

Pretty sure the dear departed "statto" (aka Raider) used to post stats on retirements from major events based on model+cause.

 

Glad to step into his boots!

[RobPearce]

3 hours ago, JohnD said:

Just PM me with your team number, which will be confidential, what failed, what you did about it, could you continue or was it terminal, plus any other comments?

Are you looking just for this year's data, or would old-timers with rambling memories be welcome to list things they fixed by the roadside back in 1996?

[PeteStupps]

3 hours ago, JohnD said:

Has CT ever collected a list of failed parts on the RBRR (or 10CR)?     It should be anonymised, to spare teams' blushes, but would be a useful guide to what to take as spares. 

John I'd like to see this sort of info, would be useful as well as interesting. At the drivers' briefing we were told about common causes for retirement (wheel bearings, alternators, driveshafts, water-pumps) so presume those are recorded every year but you / we / someone could also record failures that didn't result in retirement because they were fixable. 

A form or set of questions might be good. In fact a questionnaire to all crews could gather a lot of interesting stats that would be good fodder for Club Torque or the forum - info about the car, fuel economy, failures + fixes. 

Personally I don't mind admitting that I've now had two dynamo failures in two RBRR's. And the spare one was playing up on Sunday after a few miles. And no I'm not going to fit an alternator but might try changing the regulator 🙂

[thescrapman]

On previous occasions my Monday relaxation has been to try and find all the problems and retirements from people's forum postings and message diary etc.

Just so I can work out why I failed to see someone, be it The you dropped out or I just wasn't looking.

Will see I found I can find any of them

 

Over the years I have had a few issues, but no retirements yet.

1300fwd (underpowered, but that isn't a fault) - carb jet pipes were poor quality and kept collapsing in the heat acting like valves - 48 hours of misfiring.

Mk1 2000 - carb jet o-rings started leaking badly - blagged some PI injector ones that fitted

Mk1 PI - fuel pump burnt out, steering rack inner joints failed, co-driver collapsed (does that count?) - lost a rear wheel stud, replaced.

Dolomite Sprint - rotor arm and cap failed (both new)

Mk2 2000 - engine earth failed, meant lights went out as you dipped clutch - noisy gearbox (ignored)

Mk1 PI - Electronic Ignition failed due to wire rubbing on rotor arm

Mk2 Estate - Distributor failure

Mk2 2000 - front disks warped, drag strut bushes failed - ignored

Mk2 2000 - Rear driveshaft UJ failed - (Ignored but did have a spare if needed) - rear seat springs collapsed.

[Jason]

For this thread I'm interested in all RBRRs not just this one. We will have stats in due course, once all the data has been collated and when Nigel comes back from his therapy (sorry, holiday).

[JohnD]

12 hours ago, RobPearce said:

Are you looking just for this year's data, or would old-timers with rambling memories be welcome to list things they fixed by the roadside back in 1996?

Lets keep it to this year only.    While memories are fresh!

[JohnD]

From others' posts above, it looks as if CT does collect lists of failed components.  So, come on CT, do you want this doing, or are you doing it already?   No point in duplicating work, and TBH you are better placed to do it!

I'm asking, after criticising people who load their boots with spares and stores, and being told I'm an armchair critic.   I want to help!

But I want to help people to do the RBRR (or 10CR) with more confidence in their cars!    I speak from a background in motorsport, and in particular 40 minute and endurance racing, where mechanical or electronic failure is very rare indeed, because the cars are tested first!   How many RBRRers will drive a significant distance to test their cars before the event?   Or even, dare I say, take it to a track day, where it can be stressed much more than it will ever be on the road?      Many track days operate in groups that seperate experienced racers away from newbies, so look for one of those!

CT, please let me know if you want this list compiled, or are you doing it yourselves?

John

 

Edited October 6, 2021 by JohnD

[Jason]

Alright John, calm down, it's in hand but not very this minute 🙄

Some of us are repairing what broke last weekend or preparing for the next one, or just putting Triumph stuff to one side and reacquainting ourselves with our families.

There's 2 years until the next one, this is the time for a bit of armchair research, data gathering, discussion and stock taking. We're building agendas at the moment.

[RobPearce]

4 minutes ago, JohnD said:

How many RBRRers will drive a significant distance to test their cars before the event? 

That one probably varies. My entries have ranged from a car that was my daily transport at the time (2500S, had a failed UJ but I'd packed a spare driveshaft so it was an easy fix) to a car that, due to unfortunate timing, had covered only 40 miles in 4 years before being driven to the start (GT6, snapped fan belt and broken exhaust mount, first easily fixed, latter "bodged" by strapping the tail pipe up to the bumper with a leather belt). This year my local group had organised a trip up through the Peaks, Lakes and Dales for the days after the drivers' meeting, which shook down my Spitfire enough that I bailed at the end of the first day to go home and replace the failed gearbox mount, while I already had time off work, rather than leaving it to the last minute.

[JohnD]

If I may say so, Sir, your comment proves my point!

There is a certain satisfaction in a successful roadside repair (aka bodge) that lets you continue!     But it should not be necessary!   This event is (allegedly) a recreation of the original reliability tests by Triumph.  Can anyone imagine the factory letting cars go out  that had not been tested first, by use locally as much as possible?

I'm very aware that many are short of time to do this, and the cost must be included.    But they are investing that in this event, and that 12%  withdrew during the course will be a great disappointment for them   Some seed funding, in local testing and practice wil secure their investment and thier enjoyment!

JOhn

[JohnD]

Jason,

If CT will collect the parts failure stats, then fine, I'll stand down.     As to when to do it, I'd build it into the event, not leave it 'til  later, but that's your choice.

John

[Clive]

28 minutes ago, JohnD said:

Jason,

If CT will collect the parts failure stats, then fine, I'll stand down.     As to when to do it, I'd build it into the event, not leave it 'til  later, but that's your choice.

John

John, it really is in hand. There are all sorts of messages etc that the organisers have about issues. It just needs putting into a format that is usable, and that means picking through 100s of messages about all sorts of things.

I was marshalling at the start and indeed finish, which was fantastic. Really enjoyed it, but I felt a little tired after that. And it was just 8 hours on Friday, about 5 on sunday plus drinking in the bar after. Virtually all the organisers take part in the event, so as Json pointed out, are too knackered/busy/catching up at home etc to do the compiling. Chief marshall (or whatever title Nigel uses) has wisely gone on his hols. Don't blame him after all his work in the lead up to the event. 

No rush at all. This sort of stuff is always best once the dust has settled, and some breakdowns may need investigating to find the root cause. Again, that may not happen immediately.

It will all come out in the wash, the organisers do a fantastic job year on year, and the event was a great success despite all the problems caused by the media in the final days before the start.

[JohnD]

Glad to hear that it's all in hand! 

And well done to all,organisers and teams, if they completed or not!