Clutch Won't fully Disengage

[cammmy]

Hi Guys

It seems the clutch won't fully disengage on the Trump. Have been told it could be the brass bush or the bearing carrier (not sure if that's the proper term) that the fork levers against (not sure if that's ther proper term either ;D) may be of the older, crappier type.

The problem is definitely worse when warm.

The slave cylinder is set to the position on the lever that provides maximum movement.

Anyone have any other ideas? I will have a good look at the hose to see if I can find any air bubbles.

[DJB_Harvey]

Check to see what size of clutch slave cylinder is fitted , if you have a 1" bore change it to a 7/8" one that gives more travel albeit a slightly heavier pedal . Get one that's suitable for a Series 3 Land - Rover , cheaper and a lot more reliable than OE fitment .

[piman]

Hello cammy,

when hot the plastic hose can baloon a bit losing some of the action at the slave? I and quite a few others swap them for solid pipes (With a short flexible at the slave).

Alec

[Richard B]

Have you checked your thrust washers on the crank....

Also worn clevis pins at pedal or release arm,

Worn clevis pin holes

Broken internal spring inside master cylinder (usually caused by broken pedal spring)

Worn release arm, worn release arm bushes.

[Nigel A]

I've got a similar problem on my Mk1.  

Crunches badly, especially into second gear.  The first change into second as I drive away in the morning is often almost impossible.  New 7/8" slave cyl, fork set on middle hole, bled it several times.

But - mine only does it when cold; as it warms up it works OK unless I try the odd quick downward shift into second, when it baulks a bit.

Coincidently, my TR4's new Stag box can be a right awkward sod to get into second at times, up or downshift.

Nigel

[piman]

Hello Nigel,

when did you last change the gearbox oil? I had similar problems but an oil change completely cured it.

Alec

[dazzer]

Hi cammy

All good advice on here. I would firstly sit in the car and pump the clutch pedal a number of times to see if it improves slightly and will engage easier after you've pumped it up, four or five times is enough. If it does improve than its most likely hydraulic and a new cylinder and pipe as mentioned would be a good start. If its difficult to get into reverse pop it into 1st and then back into Reverse, also works visa versa.

This might sound daft but also check theres not a load of carpet or speedo cable etc jammed where the pedal hits the floor. I would also take a close look as mentioned above at the clevis pin, some of them can be half worn through.

Nigel are you sure you're not doing those racing changes again F1 style ;)

Cheers

Darren

[cammmy]

Thanks guys

I've removed the floor mat which gave me just enough pedal travel to get it working.

While driving it's fine but going into first when stopped can be hard when warm. It doesn't crunch; you just have to pump the pedal a couple of times and push hard. Crunches going into reverse though. Also, sometimes in first or reverse, the car will still crawl slowly with the clutch in.

[Roger Keys]

2277 wrote:

I've got a similar problem on my Mk1.  

Crunches badly, especially into second gear.  The first change into second as I drive away in the morning is often almost impossible.  New 7/8" slave cyl, fork set on middle hole, bled it several times.

But - mine only does it when cold; as it warms up it works OK unless I try the odd quick downward shift into second, when it baulks a bit.

Coincidently, my TR4's new Stag box can be a right awkward sod to get into second at times, up or downshift.

Nigel

As already suggested, thats your gearbox, not your clutch.

[Roger Keys]

Richard_B wrote:

Have you checked your thrust washers on the crank....

Also worn clevis pins at pedal or release arm,

Worn clevis pin holes

Broken internal spring inside master cylinder (usually caused by broken pedal spring)

Worn release arm, worn release arm bushes.

agreed. One, some or all of the above! Oh the hours ive wasted on these!

[cammmy]

Cool, will start going through the list ::)

Edit: as the car was an auto, are the thrust bearings any more or less likely to be worn?

[heraldhabitat]

Just had a problem with my herald and the clevis pin being worn made all the difference, new pin, and first/reverse was ok....

[piman]

Hello cammy,

one other small point is the idle speed, if it's a bit high that won't help?

Alec

[Nigel A]

I had suspected the gearbox but we always hope it will be the simpler/cheaper explanation, don't we?

Will try an oil change, the car is new to me so haven't even checked the level yet!.  It's up on the lift at the moment getting it's new suspension fitted so won't take long to do.  With a bit of luck I'll get the same result as Alec.

C'mon, Darren, you know me, old git, gentle driver.....can you get sequential boxes for Mk1 2000's and are they homologated for historic rallying?

Nigel

[Richard B]

880 wrote:

Cool, will start going through the list ::)

As the clutch works when you pump it I would suspect;

"Broken internal spring inside master cylinder (usually caused by broken pedal spring)"

880 wrote:

Edit: as the car was an auto, are the thrust bearings any more or less likely to be worn?

Less, however a worn thrust washer would not show up until you then fitted a clutch! Try moving the pulley at the front of the timing chain cover with a screwdriver as a lever.

[Richard B]

roger_keys wrote:

One, some or all of the above! Oh the hours ive wasted on these!

:) How do you think I managed to prepare that list......   :B

[Nick Jones]

2277 wrote:

I've got a similar problem on my Mk1.  

Crunches badly, especially into second gear.  The first change into second as I drive away in the morning is often almost impossible.  New 7/8" slave cyl, fork set on middle hole, bled it several times.

But - mine only does it when cold; as it warms up it works OK unless I try the odd quick downward shift into second, when it baulks a bit.

Coincidently, my TR4's new Stag box can be a right awkward sod to get into second at times, up or downshift.

Nigel

That sounds oil related to me - perhaps with somewhat tired synchros thrown in.  I've found Redline MTL to be good at reducing that problem.  Worked wonders with a rather notchy Toyota box.....  You can get it from Opie oils among others

Nick

[cammmy]

Richard_B wrote:

As the clutch works when you pump it I would suspect;

"Broken internal spring inside master cylinder (usually caused by broken pedal spring)"

Cool. First thing I'll do though is re-bleed and lower the idle speed (is a tad high)

Will start looking at the other items on the list after that.

Cheers for the input guys. Appreciated.

[cammmy]

I've ordered a new slave cylinder as when we tried to bleed the clutch again my friend said he saw bubbles coming from the boot around the piston.

Hopefully that resolves the issue.

[kenv8pi]

Hi Cammmy

If you get a metal pipe from the master to the slave will help with the clutch release use a very short rubber or airoquip hose from the body to the sleve if you still have the red plastic pipe they expand when hot so can add to the clutch not releasing
you can use a cylinder from a range rover classic same size bore as the triumph and here in the uk cheaper then some triumph spares

Ken

[cammmy]

^That's a very good point, thanks!

Slave was about 20 quid new so not too bad.

[cammmy]

Does anyone know what ID piping should be used for the clutch? Could you use the same for the fuel line under the bonnet too?

[cammmy]

Sorry, I'll re-phrase that.

Does anyone know what ID/OD piping to use when making a clutch pipe? Planning to re-use the standard fittings at the master and slave cylinders.

Would the same pipe also be suitable to use between the fuel pump and carbies?

[piman]

Hello Cammy,

the clutch pipe work is 1\4" O.D.
You can see the difference in this picture.

Alec

[cammmy]

Cheers bud.

Unlikely that I'm going to be able to source piping before I'm planning to take it away.

Brother thinks he can re-make a plastic pipe at work which should last until I can sort the piping and tools I need to do the job properly.