the ideal workshop bench

[Steve AKA vitessesteve]

I am intending to build my own workshop bench. I have some 4inch square fence posts for the legs. I saved some kitchen counter top when a neighbour remodelled their kitchen. Also available is some large planks previously used to shutter the workshop base 220*40 so very strong.

What would you recommend? Any design tips?

Needs to be strong enough to support a large pillar drill and large components such as gearbox or diffs, maybe even a Triumph 6 cylinder engine.

[65redspit]

Large cast iron vice …

 

[Adrianb]

Build it high enough so you don’t have to bend over it when working with it and make sure it’s under your lifting gear exactly right! Presuming yours is over head! If not make sur you have good clearance under the table so a crane leg can go under! Don’t forget to put a good strong vice on it.

[thescrapman]

Make sure it it solidly attached to the floor and wall. 

[Colin Cutts]

When I made mine I fitted lockable wheels on the bottom and glad I did it’s really stable when locked and handy when you want to move it around sorry I am late in posting on this topic 

[JohnD]

PLus 1 for the scrapman's advice.   If you want to have a vice and a pillar drill on it, as well as put some welly into work on the bench, wheels really won't do!  Build it into a corner, so that you can use masonry bolts through the legs on two sides.   You have some kitchen counter top, but that's not really tough enough!    After finding the same from thick timber planking, I faced the part I hammer on with 5mm alloy plate, drilled and screwed, with countersinks so there no obstruction.

Then, mount a full length strip light over the bench, with a shade (you can make your own from some light alloy panelling) to keep the light out of your eyes.   An LED batten is ideal.    Run that from the same supply as you run the pillar drill, together with a multi-socket extension on the wall as well, but put a "residual earth current circuit breaker" between them all and the supply, to protect you . A shelf underneath, to hold scrap bins compost heaps - so useful for that little piece of tube you need!
Instead of a wheeled work bench, for light jobs get a B&D Workmate, that provides a stable surface to work on but folds up when you're finished.   You can even stand on it, unless you're a heavyweight!
Good luck!

John

Edited December 17, 2023 by JohnD

[Clive]

2 hours ago, JohnD said:

  Run that from the same supply as you run the pillar drill, together with a multi-socket extension on the wall as well, but put a "residual earth current circuit breaker"

This is worrying. Do you not have RCDs in your consumer unit? If not, it is time you did, or fit one before the CU. Or best of all, fit a full set of RCBOs.

[Howard]

Its not a good idea to run the lighting from the same RCD / ELCB as the equipment since a trip could leave you in total darkness ..

Something happened at Gatwick Airport some years ago when the power & emergency power failed and a cook was carrying a pan of boiling water - he was only save from serious injury by a single battery powered emergency light that had been overlooked...

 

[JohnD]

Clive, be calm!    I suggested it because many people have old fashioned garage wiring.  My house has circuit breakers, but my garage HAD enormous porcelain fuses.

Howard, I knew just enough to suggest the RCD, but not the point you make!   Thank you!

Not as big as this one though

 

[Howard]

John,

If you still have HRC fuses, I recommend you check carefully since electrical equipment of that era frequently used asbestos sheets and mats in their construction.

H

[JohnD]

Asbestos is overrated as a hazard!  Leave it alone and it won't come home.

[Colin Cutts]

As I stated earlier I have constructed my very robust bench and fitted wheels to each leg ( I am a retired joiner) I have been using it for the last 5 years it has presently got a fully fitted out 1300 cc a series engine sat on it ready for fitting into my mini no problems what so ever in carrying this weight I also stand on it to get to the high reach shelves my lathe is free standing my linisher bench drill and grinder sit on there own bench . Wheels mean you can move it we’re ever you want and I can assure you if manufactured using the correct materials and procedures is stable 

[Clive]

18 hours ago, Howard said:

Its not a good idea to run the lighting from the same RCD / ELCB as the equipment since a trip could leave you in total darkness ..

Something happened at Gatwick Airport some years ago when the power & emergency power failed and a cook was carrying a pan of boiling water - he was only save from serious injury by a single battery powered emergency light that had been overlooked...

 

Std house wiring thesedays is a dual RCD board, with upstairs power and downstairs lights on one RCD, and vive versa. Better is a bank of RCBOs so each circuit has its own RCD.

Not good practice to have a 30mA RCD in the house, and have that protecting teh garage, with another RCD in the garage. If you do that, it should be a 10mA RCD in the garage, but that is hopeless with power tools. What I want to do is fit a 100mA RCBO in the house to feed the garage, but a C curve so it copes with my welder better. It will be OK with current regs as the garage supply cable is SWA and buried more than 50mm under floors etc. and nearly a metre deep across the garden. Then I can fit a 30mA RCD in the garage. That will be more convenient for when I cut the grinder cable or whatever. 

[JohnD]

Colin,

I'm sorry if my denigration of a wheel mounted bench offended you!   I have several engine trolleys on wheels, with six castors  each, on which they live before and after rebuilds as they can be moved a bout for storage and retrieval.   A couple of engine stands, both on their own wheels, support them during a rebuild. My lathe also is on castors, for similar storage reasons.    But a bench on which you will saw, chisel or otherwise exert repetitive manual effort really needs to be bolted to the wall, IMHO.      Perhaps a joiner like you could make one stiff enough to be bolted to the floor! 

Clive,

To have people like you on the message board, who have detailed experience and knowledge is invaluable!  Especially when they explain their knowledge as you have about small and large current  RCDs.   But it is so easy to slip into full jargon mode!  I've looked up "RCBO" and I understand it all except for the last bit!  "Overcurrent"??   So I didn't even bother looking up "C curve!   A short tutorial, please?

And, while I have such an expert tutor to hand, may I ask about my TRansit?    Equipped as a day van, it has an exterior socket and interior wiring for an electrical 'hook-up' on a camp site.   As the van is only used intermittently, I have installed a battery charger on board, that runs off a domestic 3-pin plug inside the van.       When I plug the hook-up to the exterior socket, the other end already in a 3-pin in the garage, the RCD trips.      If I connect the hook-up, then plug it into the garage socket, no problem.      Is this a problem, or the RCD just doing what it should?   Thanks!

John

[Howard]

54 minutes ago, Clive said:

Not good practice to have a 30mA RCD in the house, and have that protecting teh garage, with another RCD in the garage. If you do that, it should be a 10mA RCD in the garage, but that is hopeless with power tools. What I want to do is fit a 100mA RCBO in the house to feed the garage, but a C curve so it copes with my welder better. It will be OK with current regs as the garage supply cable is SWA and buried more than 50mm under floors etc. and nearly a metre deep across the garden. Then I can fit a 30mA RCD in the garage. That will be more convenient for when I cut the grinder cable or whatever. 

Clive,

When I rewired my previous house, (I am a chartered electrical engineer & this was before the requirement for Part P certification) I replaced the original VLCB (voltage operated circuit breaker) with a combination of RCD's - the whole house was then protected with a 100mA breaker, the sockets with 30mA and the stables with 10mA (horses are more susceptible to electrocute than humans) which worked well, provided reasonable discrimination and avoided nuisance trips. In my current house I will be modifying the wiring to the garage / workshop since the builders installed a 16A supply fed from the main consumer unit along with the house sockets all protected by a 30mA RCD, connected to 13A fused switched spur unit feeding a buried armoured cable to the garage where another small 30mA protected consumer unit is installed supplying the sockets and lighting... Needless to say no discrimination at all - but it is safe.

I haven't checked the building regs / BS7671 requirements for a few years, but does the buried feed to your garage need to be protected by a RCB when a MCB / MCCB suffice? Then inside the garage the sub-distribution board could be a mixture of individually protected circuits with 30mA for lighting and 13A sockets plus a 100mA C curve unit feeding a dedicated BS 4344 240 v socket for the welder.

Cheers

Howard

[Clive]

7 minutes ago, Howard said:

Clive,

When I rewired my previous house, (I am a chartered electrical engineer & this was before the requirement for Part P certification) I replaced the original VLCB (voltage operated circuit breaker) with a combination of RCD's - the whole house was then protected with a 100mA breaker, the sockets with 30mA and the stables with 10mA (horses are more susceptible to electrocute than humans) which worked well, provided reasonable discrimination and avoided nuisance trips. In my current house I will be modifying the wiring to the garage / workshop since the builders installed a 16A supply fed from the main consumer unit along with the house sockets all protected by a 30mA RCD, connected to 13A fused switched spur unit feeding a buried armoured cable to the garage where another small 30mA protected consumer unit is installed supplying the sockets and lighting... Needless to say no discrimination at all - but it is safe.

I haven't checked the building regs / BS7671 requirements for a few years, but does the buried feed to your garage need to be protected by a RCB when a MCB / MCCB suffice? Then inside the garage the sub-distribution board could be a mixture of individually protected circuits with 30mA for lighting and 13A sockets plus a 100mA C curve unit feeding a dedicated BS 4344 240 v socket for the welder.

Cheers

Howard

Bit of a grey area that would cause an argument on an electricians forum! From memory, if no RCD protection the cables need to be buried at least 50mm or (I think, need to check) 3mm steel protection. So I should be OK.  But a 100mA would be a sensible precaution. Plan B is to use a switched fuse, which are difficult to blow. 

Some RCBOs are very cheap now, £10ish, so I could use those in the garage. But not compatable (from regs point of view) with my Wylex CU and mainswitch. Besides, a single RCD should be adequate for a garage. 

I need to be careful, as I said much of this is not "normal" stuff that I deal with day to day. So I should refer to BS7671. Danger is that it will send me to sleep before I find out what I need. 

[Howard]

55 minutes ago, JohnD said:

 But it is so easy to slip into full jargon mode!  I've looked up "RCBO" and I understand it all except for the last bit!  "Overcurrent"??   So I didn't even bother looking up "C curve!   A short tutorial, please?

And, while I have such an expert tutor to hand, may I ask about my TRansit?    Equipped as a day van, it has an exterior socket and interior wiring for an electrical 'hook-up' on a camp site.   As the van is only used intermittently, I have installed a battery charger on board, that runs off a domestic 3-pin plug inside the van.       When I plug the hook-up to the exterior socket, the other end already in a 3-pin in the garage, the RCD trips.      If I connect the hook-up, then plug it into the garage socket, no problem.      Is this a problem, or the RCD just doing what it should?   Thanks!

John

RCBO is a combined device that protects against both overload and earth faults (ie electrocution) Typically it will be 32A B 30mA rated. The 32A shows it can supply a load of 32 A continuously without tripping on overload, the "B" is the overload curve which indicates how long an overload can be present before it trips. This is necessary to stop nuisance trips every time you switch on anything with a motor (e.g. heating pump, shower pump etc.) when the instantaneous starting current can be as mush as 12 times the running current. The 30mA is the maximum earth leakage current allowable for safety before it trips - statistically this should protect your heart if you touch a live conductor while also touching something earthed.

Regarding your camper van, I don't know the applicable current rules, but it sounds like a problem with inrush currents being seen as an earth fault.

 

[Howard]

30 minutes ago, Clive said:

But not compatable (from regs point of view) with my Wylex CU and mainswitch. Besides, a single RCD should be adequate for a garage.

Clive, what's the issue with the regs and compatibility here?

My understanding is that all sockets need 30mA RCD protection so you will still have issues with your welder.  I had a similar issue at a motor workshop not long after the use of ELCB protection became mandatory in the 1980's

[JohnD]

Thank you, Howard.   Clearly the intricacies of modern wiring are as difficult to understand as the Fick Principle for cardiac output!   I'll continue to plug my hook-up in, then turn it on!

John

[Wendy Dawes]

I have a big old wooden bench and a bloody powerful torch lol and a couple of plug sockets, that’s all I need 😂😂

[Amy Wade]

My garage is only suitable for keeping my car in, it's in a block with no power or water. To overcome this I use this place when I want to work on my car.

https://thisisyourgarage.com/

[Clive]

3 hours ago, Howard said:

Clive, what's the issue with the regs and compatibility here?

 

Manufacturer should be the same for a CU and its contents. Wylex RCBOs are not cheap! (and that is why they are not used much domestically, customers are given the choice, £80 or £180 for a new CU, and they don't understand the benefits. Or the fact it is adding a smallish % to the overall costs. 

[Steve AKA vitessesteve]

Today I lifted my pillar drill onto my bench. 

[JohnD]

Good bench!

Mine is similar, very stout wood, bolted to the wall.  Had it forty years.    May I suggest some metal sheathing at the front, where you may hammer things?    I used large counter sunk screws to hold down some 4mm aluminium tread plate, upside down for a smooth working surface.

John

[Steve AKA vitessesteve]

Now with bolted on bench grinder and 6 inch vice