US vs EU Headlights?

[XplusYplusZ]

I bought my gt6 from a guy who had imported it from California to Germany. He never drove it here. So I have the joyous adventure of registering an imported car as a historic vehicle in Deutschland.. fun.

However, the reason for this background is because Gerhard, the Bavarian, told me that I would need to change the headlamps in order to comply with local legislation... He'd bought the headlamps, but hadn't got round to changing them.

Having a look at the current ones vs. the spare ones, i cant really see what the difference will be between the ones legal in the US, and the ones legal in Germany.

Anybody know of any likely differences? I'm a little loathed to take the current ones off if there's no need to..

Cheers

Chris

[jonnyk5614]

Just a thought, if registering is a pain then could you UK import (only need an MOT) and then import to Germany. I seem to recall it is simply a form to import within UK.

Anyway, US vs EU. US lights have no kick-up on the left hand side. They are simply a flat beam. EU have the pavement side kick-up.

[ferny]

Most of the EU drives on the right... So the beam scatter should be ok unless the US has a wildly different style.  He may have feared that they need a EU stamp on them just like all new lights need. Although in the UK cars built before a certain year aren't required to have that as they can be used with their original spec lights which pre-date that law. Can't remember when that was though but I doubt a spit. requires it.

[SpitNoir]

Hi Xplus.
Like ferny said, it could be just a legal requirement from a testing and paperwork standpoint. Just like we're supposed to use headlamps with the DOT (Department of Transportation) mark in them.
But I can say one thing, if it's like all the lights in my experience, the EU lights will have WAY better beam patterns, from a driver's standpoint. Depending on the age and brand of the DOT lamps, they could be anywhere from pretty decent, to just acceptable to downright lousy.
Often you get st a subdued blob of light that you can hope puts light somewhere useful. A real good one from a recent vintage is somewhat acceptable, but if you have the option, I'd run, or at least try, the EU-legal lights.
The thought was that we wanted dip-beams that were more friendly to oncoming traffic. The reality was just the opposite though. The non-DOT compliant lights often had a much sharper vertical cutoff (similar to a "fog" light over here) that, along with that high right flare, made for not only traffic friendly lights, but very good for seeing street signs and the odd buffalo thinking about crossing the road at night.

When I've looked at what's called an E-code, or "Euro-spec" lamp here, I don't remember seeing any specific markings to that effect. They're just identified by their lack of the DOT stamp.
The DOT lights are well marked, but the others don't seem to be. At least with the older lamps I use. Perhaps current offerings are well marked with the proper certifications for your region.
Brands such as Cibi� offer both left-hand and right-hand drive beams. Standard Hella E-code lights (as sold over here anyway) are only listed for left-hand drive (right side of the road) with the high kick-up on the right (curb side) like johnnyk was talking about. Hella sells a decent DOT version too, but most here still prefer the non-DOT version, which is sold as "Motorcycle and Off-Road Only" replacement lamps.

Personally, I'd try both of the types you received with the car. Just for fun (and so you can tell us what you think!). I realize that changing out lamp assemblies on a Spitfire is not the same quick and simple affair that it is with many other vehicles, but I think it'd totally be worth your time.  I tried 7 different brands (8 styles) of H4 replacement lamps in my Bronco to see if I could find one I liked. Tried 4 of the large rectangular ones in my pickup too, for the same reason. Bosch, Carrello, Lucas, Cibi�, Hella, Eagle Eye, and one other that I can't remember right now.
HUGE difference between most brands.

Have fun!

Paul

[uksnatcher]

4314 wrote:

Having a look at the current ones vs. the spare ones, i cant really see what the difference will be between the ones legal in the US, and the ones legal in Germany.

Anybody know of any likely differences? I'm a little loathed to take the current ones off if there's no need to..

Cheers

Chris

Hi Chris.
As Ferny mentioned the EU/BS marking is not required on vehicles registered before 1st April 1986....so GT6 is not legaly required to have EU approval or BS mark.

The standard US headlamps fitted may or may not have the kick to the right for German roads so the spares will look the same if they are EU lights aready fitted, aim the headlamps against a wall on dipped beam and if US/DOT headlamps are fitted you will get a straight line or circular spot beam..so need changing, if the aim kicks to the right you have EU type headlamps for right hand side of the road driving IE Germany or US.. so dont need changing.

Can you show some pics of the headlamps fitted and the spares?

Gaz  

[uksnatcher]

3040 wrote:

HUGE difference between most brands.

Have fun!

Paul

Totally agree Paul....
Lucas / Cibie seem to be the ones to have for spit/gt6 but also an important factor is the bulb.

I have Philips extreme in my headlamps and Osram Night Breaker Plus come a close second, coupled with a relay offer superior headlamps over standard halogen headlamp bulbs.

[herald948]

US-spec. headlamps, during the period in which Spitfires were produced, were basically miserable excuses for candles. But they were cheap, and the whole unit got replaced for about $2.00 US when a filament burnt out. Also during that period, there were virtually no halogen- or other-bulb replacement units that were "certified" for the US and/or many states (where laws occasionally differed; some states allowed halogen replacements, and others didn't). Beyond that fact that most US-spec. headlamps of the period were cheap tungsten-filament bulbs with lousy light patterns, the primary distinguishing feature was the three little "nibs" molded into the outside of the glass; they were there to fit into the clamp-on headlamp alignment tools that many shops used -- mostly to make money by telling you that your headlamps were out of alignment.  ;D

Regardless of the fact that those US-spec. bulbs don't comply with most European regulations, there is no reason to keep them on a car. IIRC, it was around the end of Spitfire production, if not after, that US bulb manufacturers began offering halogen sealed beam replacement bulbs, which were a bit brighter than the old tungsten bulbs but little better in terms of light pattern.

[aar0sc]

Three "nibs" on the outside of the glass?

Pretty sure my (UK) Spit has those :/

[lordleonusa]

Those nibs locate the lens in the chromed steel ring that holds the lamp in place, IIRC.

I drove in the UK and Europe from 1981-2002, and do not recall ever being nearly blinded by vehicles coming in the opposite direction.  

I have driven here in the USA since 2002, and every night I am constantly blinded by vehicles coming the other way, some of it is caused by those ghastly mega-bright HID lamps, that don't seem to have any focus, other than directly ahead, and in my opinion should be banned, (are you listening BMW and Audi?)

And then there are all the pick-up trucks, many with lift kits that place the beam directly in line with my rear view mirror, (there are laws about headlamp beam height here, but they are ignored)

Then there are the people with one lamp out, or one lamp way out of adjustment pointing at the sky.

But notwithstanding all of the above, the actual capsules are differently made, so they do not seem to have any kind of cut off to avoid blinding other drivers, unlike in Europe, where they do.

Europe, and especially Germany seem to be streets ahead in headlamp and capsule technology.

I like Philips extreme in my headlamps and Osram Night Breaker Plus, both excellent capsules, both made in Germany, I believe.

Leon  





  

[herald948]

lordleonusa wrote:

Those nibs locate the lens in the chromed steel ring that holds the lamp in place, IIRC.

Not quite, Leon, although there are "locators" on the back side as well.

Here's a picture of a typical 6012 headlamp bulb; you hopefully can make out the little "nubs" at about 10:30, 1:30 and 6:00 positions on the lens.

[ferny]

lordleonusa wrote:

Europe, and especially Germany seem to be streets ahead in headlamp and capsule technology.


Leon  

What you described is exactly the same here.

[XplusYplusZ]

Thank you all - really useful. I'll check the spread patterns tomorrow.

[lordleonusa]

Thought this photo might be good for a laugh, the headlamps don't really point upwards that much, it's got more to do with the digital camera's algorithms than reality!

FWIW, I am presently using

Main Beam
H1 (64150), Osram Nightbreakers + 90 Ultra-High Output.

Main/Dip Beam
H4 (64193), Phillips Xtreme Power.

L

[lordleonusa]

See this page, it explains some of the differences between H4 (Europe) and 9003 (USA)

http://candlepowerinc.com/pdfs/H4_9003.pdf

[aar0sc]

Actually, looking at my headlamps today, the LHS one says "LUCAS" in the middle, and has "SEALED BEAM" at the bottom, and the RHS one just says:
"L
E
F
T
   D
   R
   I
   V
   E"

What's up with that then?!

[smithy]

The words LEFT DRIVE refer to the side of the road you drive on with it fitted - so don't drive on the wrong side of the road or that headlight will go out.
I'm off to photograph my car in the dark since Léon's looks so darn good. Is there a light on in the interior Léon?

[lordleonusa]

Yes, it is a small florescent tube about 3 feet long.

I would like to improve on that photo though, with more light from above.

Leon

[aar0sc]

Thanks goodness - cheers Super Smithy! :)

I should do that :)

[lordleonusa]

Oh yes, I forgot to mention that my actual lamps - not the capsules, are Cibie Z180's.

Leon

[XplusYplusZ]

So, when I switch from the US self contained Lamps to the EU lamps, will i need a kit to convert the wiring?

[aar0sc]

3122 wrote:

Actually, looking at my headlamps today, the LHS one says "LUCAS" in the middle, and has "SEALED BEAM" at the bottom, and the RHS one just says:
"L
E
F
T
   D
   R
   I
   V
   E"

What's up with that then?!

[Docman]

3122 wrote:

Actually, looking at my headlamps today, the LHS one says "LUCAS" in the middle, and has "SEALED BEAM" at the bottom, and the RHS one just says:
"L
E
F
T
   D
   R
   I
   V
   E"

What's up with that then?!

The headlamp optics are supposed to be different for left and right hand drive vehicles - you want the beam to point where you want it most.
Regardless, I would start by throwing away anything that's a sealed beam - old, inefficient technology.