Diff seals

[WIMPUS]

Hi,

I've got a spare diff in the garage (previous in the shed  :P ).
Wanting to renew the seals on it..
I've already got it apart, made a drain plug on it and got a new seal on the 2 halves .

Now wanting to renew the other 3 seals on it.
Bearing seem to be good, actually think they replaced the bearings & seals not that long ago.
They had used gasket sealant everywhere.

Now i don't get the bearing off the shaft on the right side one.
Do i use a puller or something else ?  :)

Also how to renew the front one ?
I think get it loose and changing the seal is nothing major, but get it back tight is the problem (i think it was what i read)  because it's a collapsable spacer type normally.

First pic is of the shaft where the bearing doesn't want to come off.

[Dogsbody47uk]

Hi Wimpus. You need a puller to get the bearing off the shaft. Once you have done that you can replace the oil seal. With the front pinion oilseal you have a problem. If it is fitted with a collapsible spacer then do not re torque it to the quoted figure, because that will wreck it and require a diff overhaul to sort it out!. I believe the technique is to Mark the nut before removal and count the exact turns required to remove it, and on re-assembly replicate the exact number of turns to refit the nut. Cheers, Dave.

[WIMPUS]

9110 wrote:

Hi Wimpus. You need a puller to get the bearing off the shaft. Once you have done that you can replace the oil seal. With the front pinion oilseal you have a problem. If it is fitted with a collapsible spacer then do not re torque it to the quoted figure, because that will wreck it and require a diff overhaul to sort it out!. I believe the technique is to Mark the nut before removal and count the exact turns required to remove it, and on re-assembly replicate the exact number of turns to refit the nut. Cheers, Dave.

Dave, i heard and read the same thing on the internet about the pinion oil seal and as the later diffs (1500) has a collapsible spacer ..  :o

Will investigate some more or maybe o here someone will know . :)

[john2502]

JY Classics did mine last year, not sure if the pics will help at all but anyway

[Velocita Rosso]

The puller should be behind the bearing, preferably with a split bearing collar
https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/cht226-bearing-separator?da=1&TC=SRC-split%20bearing
Some need a 5 tonne press to get them off

[ferny]

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/cht227-hydraulic-puller-set?da=1&TC=SRC-hydraulic%20bearing


These will normally shift stubborn ones.

[yorkshire_spam]

I bent a cheap bearing splitter trying to get mine off, eventually I destroyed the bearing (smashed outer race, removed balls, ground and split inner race) and replaced it.
IIRC they are 6205C3 bearings - about 7ukp around here, so I wasn't that bothered.
If you take the front flange off, mark the nut first,mark the flange and casing and re-assemble to same marks - no need to be messing around with that stupid spacer unless you want to strip and replace pinion bearings etc.

[mikeyb]

collapsable spacer type normally has a big nyloc, torque type a castellated nut and split pit

[WIMPUS]

7801 wrote:

JY Classics did mine last year, not sure if the pics will help at all but anyway

We had a try that same way !
The flange bended a bit  :-/

[WIMPUS]

michael_charlton wrote:

The puller should be behind the bearing, preferably with a split bearing collar
https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/cht226-bearing-separator?da=1&TC=SRC-split%20bearing
Some need a 5 tonne press to get them off

Seen these and do like the idea  ::)

[WIMPUS]

MikeyB wrote:

collapsable spacer type normally has a big nyloc, torque type a castellated nut and split pit

But i do have one with a big nyloc !
Been to a friend this afternoon and he was going to do the same on his new second had spit diff, so he wants to know how to do it with the collapsable spacer.

Do you have more info about how to remove it & but back the good way ?

[MK3]

I have just replaced mine, see my last post here how I did it =>

Sorry , link no longer available

[MikeTeesside]

ferny wrote:

https://www.machinemart.co.uk/shop/product/details/cht227-hydraulic-puller-set?da=1&TC=SRC-hydraulic%20bearing


These will normally shift stubborn ones.

I have one of these and they're absolutely brilliant, well worth the money.

Also used it when I did these on my own diff, worked a treat. ;)

[WIMPUS]

What an afternoon we had  :o :o
Asked my friend for help with the diff, so after 30min he was there.
Had a look how to do it , but first wanted to see for a puller.
I knew there where some pullers at my old work, so stopped there and asked it at my old boss ..

He then told me that they sold nearly everyone  ??), i knew some of them where + 30 years old  :-/
Eventually found one , but was to small..
But it was good for the pinion one.

Then been to a local shop and bought one for 7 euro, came home and the threads gave up  :( :(
So got back and got my money back & bought another one, for 8 euro  >:(
That one was a lot better (but also made in India  :o )

Had a try on the side shaft , because the bearing doesn't want to come off..
Also without any luck, it moved maybe 2mm , but doesn't want to come off  :-/
Thinking now of buying 2 new skf bearings (had a look at Triumph mart for the number, so thanks to Sam !)

Had a look at bearing shop in uk and at a shop here in Belgium, only 1 euro cheaper in the UK.
So think i'm going to buy it here  :)

http://www.klium.be/skf-6205-c3-groefkogellager-150396

[WIMPUS]

Got the bearing off the shaft ! (dance)

destroyed the bearing first and then grounded the center down until i could brake it  :)

[yorkshire_spam]

4526 wrote:

Got the bearing off the shaft ! (dance)

destroyed the bearing first and then grounded the center down until i could brake it  :)

Sounds familiar Wim :-)
You got bits like this now?

[WIMPUS]

6797 wrote:

Sounds familiar Wim :-)
You got bits like this now?

Yes i have   :P
Was a bit scary to do it actually !

Now just need to bend back the flange that bolts to the diff (where the seal is in), it's a bit bend because of the puller ..
Then i can paint it and (hopefully i got them at the weekend) install the new bearing.

Going to a friend to remove the pinion nut so i can replace that seal also.
Then install it back with the right amount of torque .
Do you know what it is ? I've looked in my friend his mkIV handbook.

[yorkshire_spam]

I would be more worried about tightening the pinion nut back to where it was before rather than the torque - do it back up tight, but don't take it any further and crush the spacer more than it already is -unless you want to have to set the pre-load etc etc.... and if you are going to do that you'll want to start with a new spacer.
Don't mix up the tightening torque with the pre-load torque!

[WIMPUS]

6797 wrote:

I would be more worried about tightening the pinion nut back to where it was before rather than the torque - do it back up tight, but don't take it any further and crush the spacer more than it already is -unless you want to have to set the pre-load etc etc.... and if you are going to do that you'll want to start with a new spacer.
Don't mix up the tightening torque with the pre-load torque!

i think i'm going to measure up how much threads i've got left and i already marked where the nut is now.
Then i will get it right back where it was.

[drofgum]

Wim,
When changing the pinion seal it is important to permanently mark the flange, the shaft, and the nut before you disturb them. Then the turns required to remove the nut should be counted including the partial turn. Once the seal has been renewed the flange should be put back on the shaft with the marks aligned and the nut turned on the same number of turns until the mark also lines up.
Overtightening will add crush to the crush spacer changing its setting. Not tightening to the same point will leave slack in the bearings.
                                                                                         Good luck,
                                                                                         Paul

[WIMPUS]

1317 wrote:

Wim,
When changing the pinion seal it is important to permanently mark the flange, the shaft, and the nut before you disturb them. Then the turns required to remove the nut should be counted including the partial turn. Once the seal has been renewed the flange should be put back on the shaft with the marks aligned and the nut turned on the same number of turns until the mark also lines up.
Overtightening will add crush to the crush spacer changing its setting. Not tightening to the same point will leave slack in the bearings.
                                                                                         Good luck,
                                                                                         Paul

I know  :)

[WIMPUS]

Been to a place i know for now 13 years where they repair tractors & farm stuff .
It took them less then 1 min to take the nut off  >:(

Got the flange off and the seal looked strange to me ...
So called up my  friend that has done it also this week.

Eventually got it to my garage to work on it, seems it was the original seal !
Metal case with a rubber/cork seal in it !

Had a look and it seems they sell both, so the original type seal and the modern one..
So does the modern seal work good then also ?  :)

Here is the type of seal that was in it : http://www.jamespaddock.co.uk/parts.aspx?searchtext=140337

The one that i've got and actually seems to fit :http://www.rimmerbros.co.uk/Item--i-DAM5079

Want to be sure when i fit it all again it's good  ;)

Was a bit of a nightmare to get the old seal out  :o

[Richard B]

4526 wrote:

Eventually got it to my garage to work on it, seems it was the original seal !
Metal case with a rubber/cork seal in it !

Here is the type of seal that was in it : http://www.jamespaddock.co.uk/parts.aspx?searchtext=140337

I suspect that is leather OE not rubber/cork.

Triumph's full of green renewable components  8)

[WIMPUS]

Richard_B wrote:

I suspect that is leather OE not rubber/cork.

Triumph's full of green renewable components  8)

;D

But should the new one do the trick also ?  :)

[Richard B]

Oh yes, just if you use the leather seals you should soak them in engine oil for a while before using.