Bonnet taking chunks out of tyre!

[jonnyk5614]

Right, never happened before but I have just moves from wire wheels to minilites.

The right wheel arch lip is taking chunks out of the wheel when on full lock and the suspension is depressed. Typically this occurs when on approx 3/4 lock and making fast right handers.

When two blokes sit on the bonnet with the wheel on 3/4 lock, the bonnet is touching the wheel.

The car was lowered an inch by the previous owner. The front suspension has spax shocks.

What is the fix here?

Am I talking bonnet adjustment or suspension. If it were suspension, I would have thought I'd be having the same problems on the left side. The bonnet appears higher on the right side (the side with the problem).

If it is suspension, can I simply fashion some sort of spacer to go between the spring and chassis or are new springs the order of the day?

Bit annoying because the bonnet is destroying the newest Goodyear on the car!

[Paudman]

1045 wrote:

When two blokes sit on the bonnet with the wheel on 3/4 lock, the bonnet is touching the wheel.

So move them off then!! (sorry..couldn't resist it!)
BUT:

This was a problem with my MK1 many years ago, when I fitted wider wheels. The return lip in the wheel arch is quite wide - almost an inch - and so any deviation from standard wheels or suspension will bring the wheel into contact; the wider the wheels or the lower the suspension, the worse it will get. This caused so much tyre damage on mine it was becoming dangerous. I had to revert to steel wheels and factory standard suspension (AVO shocks were fine) with no lowering or other adjustment whatsoever to remove the problem. Uprated springs may help, but at the cost of ride comfort, and of course you could also have a bodyworker shave off the wheelarch lip, but i went for the easier option and it's worked this last ten years.

[Velocita Rosso]

Did the car come :
Lowered ?
With wires?

Whoever did the car may have worked to the wire offset.
If you have put Minilites (6") on then thereby lies the answer
I had the same problem, but as said, I took the angle grinder to the lip and it did the trick
Also tightened up the adj AVO spring/shocker and no problems since
Also how many/much wishbone shims do you have in for the camber adj.....maybe  one side being thrown out a bit too much?

[DaveKent]

michael_charlton wrote:

Also how many/much wishbone shims do you have in for the camber adj.....maybe  one side being thrown out a bit too much?

BUT, you can't just count the number of shims on each side, because the shims are put there to adjust to equal the camber on each side, allowing for variation in the chassis etc.
so you need a geometry set up to find out if its right.

[Velocita Rosso]

xyv wrote:

BUT, you can't just count the number of shims on each side, because the shims are put there to adjust to equal the camber on each side, allowing for variation in the chassis etc.
so you need a geometry set up to find out if its right.

Thats what Im saying , whoever set the car up previously may have done it wrong , hence rechecking
Even a few thou individual shim can throw it out enough to allow a rub
I didnt mean/say just count them.

[Freebird]

Jonny

I've got a couple of 10mm thick nylon spacers that will fit between the top of the shocks and the chassis if you want them. They will raise the car by about 8mm if that's enough.

PM me your address if you want them and I'll put them in the post for free.

Glen.

[jonnyk5614]

Cheers  for the help guys! Much appreciated.


Wires and lowering done before I bought it.

I am now runnign 5.5Js on 5J minilites. Previous rims (the wires) were 5.5.

The wheel is wacking at 1 o' clock when the wheel is on 3/4 or so lock.


I have just taken to the lip with a hammer (there was a little bend in it). Raised at the cones a little and put some spacers on the catches.

I'll stick some grease on tomorrow, go for a drive and see if we have any scraping.

If we do, I think shims are in order. The springs are uprated and therefore presumably shorter(?). There are no shims.


I have no idea about any of the geometry - sorry. Never needed to touch it.


Freebird - really appreciate the offer. I'll see how tomorrow goes then might have to get back to you on that one!

Thanks for all your help.

[bob dunn]

my car does this i plan on bending the front outrigger a bit , with a six foot steel tube . measure out rigger tip to suspension on both sides,

[Velocita Rosso]

One thing not mentioned..is the bonnet, affixed at hinges, in the lowest position eg can the bonnet be lifted at the front hinges enough?

[jonnyk5614]

michael_charlton wrote:

One thing not mentioned..is the bonnet, affixed at hinges, in the lowest position eg can the bonnet be lifted at the front hinges enough?

Have't taken the over-riders off yet so I don't know. Will take a look though :)

[Dannyb]

I had the same problem because my 5 1/2 J's are fitted with bigger tyres.... can't remember size off hand but I intend to change them when they wear out. Mine would catch if I went up a slope when turning and stil do if I don't take care.
I not only raised the bonnet on the front inges bu also filed the elongated hole a bit to give even more clearance on the front arches.

[MarkB]

I have had similar issues with wheels and tyres on my lowered Mk2 GT6. Old style Dunlop steels with 175 70 13 tyres. Most problems are caused by the wheel offset being to much. Just fitted 4.5 wheels 155 70 13 Yokohama's, doesn't look nowhere near as good as wide wheels, but I can now stop clenching my teeth everytime I take a corner fast or go over a speed hump :)

`blue

[Deleted User]

Steve had similar problems to this on the 10CR in 2009. Fitted strong springs and has now fitted different radious arms?

I am sure Steve will tell all

[jonnyk5614]

1684 wrote:

I had the same problem because my 5 1/2 J's are fitted with bigger tyres.... can't remember size off hand but I intend to change them when they wear out. Mine would catch if I went up a slope when turning and stil do if I don't take care.
I not only raised the bonnet on the front inges bu also filed the elongated hole a bit to give even more clearance on the front arches.

Yeah, it is one turn in particular where I always go a bit sideways  ;D but it is up a hill. Tight 3 point turns using pavements are the same.

[GT6boy]

Why brutalise the bonnet for the want of (probable) aftermarket wheels with the wrong offset? :-/
The chances are, you've got '1 size fits all' Small chassis springs of indeterminent length, married to dampers with an incorrect spring seat heigh :Xt.
How was the car lowered?
You need wheels with the correct offset, the correct length/poundage springs and dampers with the spring seat at the correct height(adjustable spring seat height would be best). :)

[jonnyk5614]

GT6boy wrote:

Why brutalise the bonnet for the want of (probable) aftermarket wheels with the wrong offset? :-/
The chances are, you've got '1 size fits all' Small chassis springs of indeterminent length, married to dampers with an incorrect spring seat heigh :Xt.
How was the car lowered?
You need wheels with the correct offset, the correct length/poundage springs and dampers with the spring seat at the correct height(adjustable spring seat height would be best). :)

I'm not planning on butchering the bonnet - there was a small bend downward where the lip was striking the wheel (possibly caused by striking the wheel!) which I corrected.

I was told that shorter uprated springs were fitted. If I ever wanted to raise the car again, all I needed to do was purchase longer ones.

I'll probably go for some shims, unless I have no sufficiently resolved the probelm...

I wouldn't have thought minilites had incorrect offsets, everyone seems to use them with no problem.

[tiggrr1]

GT6boy wrote:

You need wheels with the correct offset, the correct length/poundage springs and dampers with the spring seat at the correct height(adjustable spring seat height would be best). :)

Thats good advice but the easy way out ;)

My alloys have a little too much offset and were running 205/60/13 tyres on the 2009 10CR and with the car loaded up on bumpy french roads while driven enthusiastically we were taking rubber off the tyres at an alarming rate  :o :o :o





That picture is pretty bad and that was with 480lb front springs on too.
As you can see from the brake dust on the wheels we were having a bit of fun they are normally shiny.
I did wind up my front adjustable shockers and spring seats after that pic but it was not enough.

After that I changed the tyres for a slightly smaller size 185/60/13 Toyo 888's  but could still catch the wheelarch lip with severe provocation, that is throwing the car into a bend having to hit the brakes when my bottle ran out and catching a bump or pothole with the suspension already compressed. (yeah I know it's not exactly the best cornering technique  :B ;D )

So the next step was to fit 650lb front springs, I was not taking the wheels and tyres off as I like the look of the wheels and the tyres stick like brown smelly stuff to a blanket. Even so I could still just make them catch the lip with the car loaded up with luggage fuel and a porky passenger ;D

So my next step was to fit some Canley Classic top front adjustable wishbones.



Doing that allowed me to remove some of the shims from the bottom wishbones where they attach to the chassis and adjust the new top wishbones to pull the tops off the wheels in enough to finally stop them rubbing the lip on the wheel arch.

At the end of the day it would have been cheaper to bend cut or grind the wheel arch lip (or change the wheels) but that was not what I wanted but I'm happy with it now, Oh and as a bonus it does go round corners rather well considering the heavy lump up front ;D

[Hugh]

Freebird wrote:

Jonny

I've got a couple of 10mm thick nylon spacers that will fit between the top of the shocks and the chassis if you want them. They will raise the car by about 8mm if that's enough.

PM me your address if you want them and I'll put them in the post for free.

Glen.

They got to you then  :)

Cheers Hugh

[Freebird]

908 wrote:

They got to you then  :)

Cheers Hugh

Ah - yes mate  :B, but by that time I had machined a pair in ali 12mm thick -  as much as the studs would allow. It was still too low so I added 20mm more spacing 'tween spring and top mount.

The nylon ones will have really done the rounds soon.

Glen.

[Hugh]

1045 wrote:

Cheers  for the help guys! Much appreciated.


Wires and lowering done before I bought it.

I am now runnign 5.5Js on 5J minilites. Previous rims (the wires) were 5.5.

The wheel is wacking at 1 o' clock when the wheel is on 3/4 or so lock.


I have just taken to the lip with a hammer (there was a little bend in it). Raised at the cones a little and put some spacers on the catches.

I'll stick some grease on tomorrow, go for a drive and see if we have any scraping.

If we do, I think shims are in order. The springs are uprated and therefore presumably shorter(?). There are no shims.


I have no idea about any of the geometry - sorry. Never needed to touch it.


Freebird - really appreciate the offer. I'll see how tomorrow goes then might have to get back to you on that one!

Thanks for all your help.

I had the same problem with lowered uprated springs until I fitted a set of spacers kindly given to me by another club sorry thier name i can recall for  now as my pain killes are kicking in anyway it worked.
thats it typing with left hand index finger has done me in.

[Freebird]

Here is a piccie of th spacers I ended up with. The springs are 480lb Moss Europe jobbies 8 3/4" free length.

The spacer above the top mount is the 12mm one and the one between it and the spring is 20mm think.

[jonnyk5614]

OK, Freebird in in Korea so does anyone have any ideas where I can get hold of these spacers. Neither Ebay, Rimmers no James Paddock seem to have them... Ebay does have a lot for 4wds but they are all about 2inches tall and I have no idea what diameter.
What ebay does have are these: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Car-Rubber-Coil-Spring-Spacers-6pc-set-BRAND-NEW-/380337579621?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item588de2e665

any ideas?

Cheers

[uksnatcher]

1045 wrote:

where I can get hold of these spacers. Neither Ebay, Rimmers no James Paddock seem to have them

What ebay does have are these: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Car-Rubber-Coil-Spring-Spacers-6pc-set-BRAND-NEW-/380337579621?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item588de2e665

Dont bother with rubber spacers , they can move about and fall out and deform under constant load, especially the ones you have located on ebay, they are quick fixes for less weighted rear coils deffo not fronts.

The alloy spacers are not available 'off the shelf' they will be milled on a lathe to your spec by your local engineering firm alot cheaper than shelling out for full adjustable struts which is your other safe option. You can also get polyurethane/nylon spacers milled too that will do the job and will be cheaper than alloy.

[Freebird]

I may be in Korea, but can still help out.

Canley's do them - have a look at this.

http://www.canleyclassics.com/?xhtml=xhtml/product/frontspringspacers.html&xsl=product.xsl

I mananged to squeeze 12mm ones in mine made from aluminium, that's the thickest the three top studs would allow. Canleys do 3/8" (9.5mm) or 11/16" (17.5mm) the latter would not have fitted my car.

[uksnatcher]

Hello Korea...its a small world..!

Expensive for what they are but not a total fix.
9.5mm spacer is ok on the studs and you could use large washers to make up the rest, depends on the length of the 3 studs, there are longer studs fitted to some end caps, shorter on others.... its the 20mm spacer between the spring and the plate 'off the shelf' thats the problem.
The ride hight needs to be raised about 1.25 inch and still no garantee the tyre wont hit the wheel arch under heavy braking or speed bump as the spring rating is unknown. 320lbs will deflect greater than 480's etc.