Probable crank seal oil leak, why?

[Zendervision]

As my engine cools it dumps a load of oil on the floor. I had thought it was the front alloy sealing block, but some further investigation shows it comes from the back. It's engine oil, and appears to be coming from the gap where the engine meets the gearbox.

Am I right in thinking crank oil seal? It doesn't lose any oil once it's cooled down, doesn't drip while idling and the level drops so slowly I don't believe it loses any while driving either.

If it is the seal, when I installed it, I got it square in the housing, I torqued the bolts correctly and went round the crank with a feeler gauge as described in the manual. If it leaks like this after I did everything right, I don't fancy my chances fixing it much! What should I do when changing the seal to ensure this doesn't just happen again?

[JohnD]

Make sure it's not gear oil.    The bell housing can get oil inside from either end.
Your nose will tell the difference!
Gear oil has a distinctly 'smokey' smell, but calibrate your nose from a can of fresh Hypoid.
JOhn

[Zendervision]

Nah, it's engine oil. I got back underneath today to have a better look... the underside's curiously clean actually with no blatantly obvious leak, but I still think it's coming from the rear seal.

Don't want to have to pull the box and everything just to change a rubber ring 🤔

[Zendervision]

Amazingly clean considering the oil slick underneath it.

[GT6 M]

the oil seal  /s over the years  may have made a groove int crank.
I have this ont front pully, remedy, set oil seal further out to clear groove.

step 2, bung some oil stop leak in, it does work.  but not if its a bigg drip, which yours dont seem to be.

M

[heraldhabitat]

I had a persistent leak, and diagnosed sump gasket failure, changed it, put it back together persistent oil leak, oh bugger I thought then a friend said check the fuel pump gasket and there it was, worth checking because I couldn't see where it was coming from while underneath checking

[Zendervision]

Fuel pump gasket, I never looked at that! That's the sort of tip I was after.

I wanna go check it now, I wish it wasn't 1am with the car parked on the street 😀

Quoted from GT6 M

the oil seal  /s over the years  may have made a groove int crank.
I have this ont front pully, remedy, set oil seal further out to clear groove.

step 2, bung some oil stop leak in, it does work.  but not if its a bigg drip, which yours dont seem to be.

M

Interesting, if it comes to renewing the seal I'll examine the end of the crank closely.

[Zendervision]

Well, it was seeping oil from the fuel pump gasket, although even after fixing that it dumped a lake of oil on the ground. Box out then 🙁

[Zendervision]

My worst fears came true. Pulled the box out, replaced the seal, hauled the box back in... and it still pees a load of oil all over the floor (less though).

All that work for nothing

[Paudman]

See the thread on the TSSC site re crankshaft wear and replacement sleeves:

http://www.tssc.org.uk/index.p.....3&id=82043#82043

just in case it turns out to be the same in your case.

[Zendervision]

Interesting link, thanks. I'll keep an eye on it and see if it resolves his oil leak.

My crank had a groove, but you could just barely feel it.

[Zendervision]

UPDATE
I bought the repair sleeve and fitted it this weekend. On closer inspection, the groove in the crank was more pronounced than I thought, quite deep. The sleeve was very easy to fit - it hammered on without difficulty. I can confirm that the part number and size in the TSSC thread are correct for this engine at least. The sleeve is very thin and the oil seal isn't noticeably tighter than it was before.

I took the car out this evening to get the oil warmed up before coming home and parking over the same drip tray from my first post. And there's no point in an 'after' picture because the leak appears to have been completely eradicated. The tray is bone dry. I am thrilled with this result because I was embarrassed to leave the car anywhere when it left so much oil behind.

So thanks to Paudman for the link, and thanks to TSSC poster Derrick Binning for the idea and part number.

[herald948]

Congratulations! It's always nice to finally solve persistent problems! (I know; occasionally, I succeed in such endeavors myself. 😉 )

[uksnatcher]

Great result.

On the fitting instructions Number 8 it says to use side cutters to remove the fitting flange on the sleeve if clearance is an issue, did you have any issues?

http://www.barnwell.co.uk/pdf/Barnwell%20Shaft%20Repair%20Kits.pdf

[Zendervision]

I worried I'd damage the sleeve if I attempted to remove the flange so I left it in place. There is enough clearance on the oil seal housing to leave it on without it touching the block or seal.

[uksnatcher]

Thats good to know.

I was thinking of using a sleeve on my 1500 front crank pulley as i fitted a new Payen timing cover seal and it still leaks, i thought the slight groove on the pulley was nothing to worry about but it obviously is.

The sleeves are not exactly cheap but alot less expensive than a new pulley or a crank repair 🙂

[junkuser]

With grooves on shafts due to grit held by seals, it is worthwhile visiting a bearing specialist to see if there is a similar ID/OD seal with the lips in a different position.
Sometimes there will be a double lip equivalent or you could use a pair of thinner seals or one with a spacer.
Even the original spec seal with a spacer behind it to move the contact area is OK in some situations.
An example of using two seals is the inner seal on the rear hub.  Two PR3195 seals fit inside the housing of the original leather seal casing so you get two lip seals running in different positions to where the leather one made contact. (that is for axle setups as used on Spitfire 4 and due to an availability problem at the time, not grooving. Grooved axles should be replaced.)
Another thing to consider is using a silicone seal, if there is an equivalent, as they seal better, especially in hot areas such as on crankshafts.

[uksnatcher]

Plenty of options there , thanks will enquire about a silicone seal.
Would the classic eng oil be ok with modern seals?  

[Matt306]

Ressurecting old thread, my rear oil seal appears to be leaking all of a sudden, the TSSC links don't work, but I think the sleeving or other seals could be an idea. Any ideas on size

[nang]

Can't remember about about the small blocks, but 2500 one has a copper washer on one of the plate bolts. obviously bolt runs into an oily part.
Tony.

[Nick Jones]

Quoted from pigboy306

Ressurecting old thread, my rear oil seal appears to be leaking all of a sudden, the TSSC links don't work, but I think the sleeving or other seals could be an idea. Any ideas on size

What engine is it?

Nick

[Pete Lewis]

the link to tssc may be to the  long dead website , but  talking to Garth tssc shop has never sold wear sleeves as far as he recollects

they are also  made by SKF  

http://www.skf.com/uk/products.....r-sleeves/index.html

its not a bodge we used them on truck axles years ago on production  to enable  serviceable economic repairs in later life

Pete

[JohnD]

I don't think this is a Daytona 1000cc, must be his 13/60.

Catalogue is here: http://www.skf.com/binary/68-128020/11337_2-EN-SKF-Speedi-Sleeve.pdf
Choosing the right size here: http://www.skf.com/uk/products.....ight-size/index.html
Or SKF offer a phone 'app' to choose from the application.  Look here: http://www.skf.com/uk/knowledge-centre/engineering-tools/skfsealselect.html


but if the seal is suddenly leaking, perhaps the seal has gone?

It's the top bolt in sixes that has the copper washer, don't know about fours.

John

[JensH]

Copper washer on the Fd 1300 engines too.

[Nick Jones]

I have a speedi sleeve on the rear crank seal of my Vitesse engine - there were some marks in the sealing area that I didn't want to risk.

SKF 99287 is the part I used for a Mk2 2L.  Suspect 13/60 Herald is smaller diameter though.

Bought mine from these folks as they were the cheapest at the time http://www.barnwell.co.uk/products/shaft-repair-kit/

Nick