Rich_s Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 rotoflex wrote:That looks different from the mixture I got when my head gasket went. I saw a yellow-ish brown sort of frothy mixture.Mine looked more like a Coke float (When you put a couple of scoops of vanilla ice cream in a tall glass & fill the glass up with Coca- Cola).likewise, whenever i have had to change the oil and gasket when something has let go i have never seem it look like someone poured a few litres or primer in the sump, more like how described above: yellowy brown not primer grey....no idea what could have caused that, have seen dark grey before when taking an moped gearbox apart that had destroyed itself but how on earth to you get light grey? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alex4wwl Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 If you have been using the car for a lot of short trips and you have NOT lost any water, it is probably condensation from the short trips and cooling down condensation Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bodders1 Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 2841 wrote:If you have been using the car for a lot of short trips and you have NOT lost any water, it is probably condensation from the short trips and cooling down condensationCondensation in the oil is unlikely to produce that much emulsification on the oil. The colour of the goo in the sump is partly determined y how clean the oil was before the water got in to it. If the oil had been freshly changed, and was clean then the emulsified goo will be milky. If the oil was old, dirty, and black, then the emulsified goo will look like Rotoflex's coke-float.I think Greenie has already put his finger on the root-cause - fitting a 1500 (recessed bore) gasket to a 1300 engine will not seal properly even when torqued down. Water will find its way into the oil. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenie Posted November 7, 2012 Author Share Posted November 7, 2012 Well, everything is back together now, new thermostat, new head gasket, fresh oil and water. I've just run it, sounds pretty good. I've used a cheapy 20w50 so to flush it and the oil looks a little milky again but I guess that's the residue of the last lot.I didn't run it long though because the temperature gauge needle moves all the way to the right, takes 3 or 4 minutes from cold I guess. The thermostat housing is very hot, but the top hose and radiator are cold suggesting that the thermostat is staying closed? I tested it in a cup of boiled water before putting it in and it worked fine. Am I missing something? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Are all the hoses getting hot?....bottom and top? any cold spots on the rad and do you have a fan fitted(although still shouldnt overheat that quickly).Could have a huge airlock.....Oops just re read your post about the top hose....Question for clever people.....if the water pump had failed could this cause something similar?How quick would poor timing cause an engine to boil? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rich_s Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 sounds like a duff water pump to me, hot engine and cold rad with a new thermostat means the water is not moving around anywhere, especially if it can reach a high temp in a few minutes, mine takes a lot longer even with no fan fitted...rich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferny Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 Aye, duff pump is my bet. Take the 'stat out and run the engine whilst looking down the radiator cap. There should be water movement which will change if you rev the engine.If you can be arsed. Personally I'd just change the pump. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
junkuser Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 The emulsion will give a fair degree of lubrication but the most likely thing to suffer is the oil pump due to the teeth still being under their full loading and having relatively small contact areas. Just check that the oil pressure is now still adequate and don't just try adjusting the pressure relief valve if it is lower than previously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard B Posted November 7, 2012 Share Posted November 7, 2012 ferny wrote:Take the 'stat out and run the engine whilst looking down the radiator cap. There should be water movement which will change if you rev the engine.Yes quick, easy cheap test. Run it without the thermostat and see if it overheats. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenie Posted November 8, 2012 Author Share Posted November 8, 2012 I've just done that - taken out thermostat and run it, the temperature gauge doesn't move much over halfway even after half an hour or so. With the radiator cap off I can see the water splosh around, drop a bit and is clearly circulating with the radiator becoming warm.Tested the thermostat again in a cup of boiling water and it opens as it should. Put it back in the car, run it for a just a few minutes and already the temp gauge needle is all the way in the red. With the rad cap off I can see the water vibrating but that's all it does.One thing that puzzles me, the Haynes manual says to drain off a couple of pints of coolant before taking off the thermostat housing to drop the level below the thermostat. I didn't do that (because I only read it after taking it off), and there was no spillage and water was just under where the temperature sender joins the housing.The level in the radiator is where it should be, as is the expansion bottle, but it did seem like not enough went in yesterday - it was only about 4 or 5 pints I would guess, which is probably about what came out when I drained it the day before.Just wondering now if there might be an airlock - any other ideas? How do I check and rectify if it is that? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard B Posted November 8, 2012 Share Posted November 8, 2012 1936 wrote:I've just done that - taken out thermostat and run it, the temperature gauge doesn't move much over halfway even after half an hour or so. With the radiator cap off I can see the water splosh around, drop a bit and is clearly circulating with the radiator becoming warm.You are UK based?In the current ambient temperature (7 - 10 degrees). I would expect your gauge to stay well below a 1/4. Is everything else correct, ignition timing, air/fuel mix...I'd suspect either the pump is not moving enough water or a blocked radiator. Run it again and check (carefully) if the whole radiator is hot or whether there are cold areas. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenie Posted November 8, 2012 Author Share Posted November 8, 2012 Thanks Richard, yes I'm just outside Bristol.I'll wait for it to cool down then give it another go. The mixture is a possibly bit rich I think, I put new plugs in when I originally got the engine going a month or two ago and they were sooty when I took them out this week. That said, I've been running it for short periods and using the choke a lot. A tune up was the next job before I noticed the over heating. I'll check the timing now as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nick Jones Posted November 8, 2012 Share Posted November 8, 2012 If the thermostat does not have a bleed hole (with or without jiggle pin) then you will struggle to fill the cooling system as the thermostat traps air. This means you can't get enough water in to reach the thermostat so it never gets warm enough to open, such coolant as in there doesn't circulate and the engine will cook.You can remove the temp sensor to bleed the air out but better to drill a small hole (2 - 3mm in the thermostat to make a permanent cure.Nick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferny Posted November 8, 2012 Share Posted November 8, 2012 Dropping the thermostat into boiling water and looking for it to open isn't a good test. You need to put it in a pan of cold water and bring it up to the boil with a thermometer in there. That way you know when it starts to open, when it is fully open and when it starts to close. I bought one for the Acclaim and the new and old 'stat were opening at 94, which simply isn't good enough and they should be open way before that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenie Posted November 8, 2012 Author Share Posted November 8, 2012 I didn't have a thermometer Ferny, so had to make do unfortunatelyChecked the timing, it was a few degrees too advanced. I don't know how to tune up the carbs so haven't really touched them for now - that's a learning curve for another day.Anyway, there's definitely an overheating problem, I ran it a bit longer without the thermostat and the temperature creeps up to the red, it is a lot slower though. Have drilled the rim of the thermostat ready for when I put it back in.The heater is blowing slightly warm air, so I'm thinking there might be an airlock somewhere. I'm just scouring earlier threads to get some ideas, but have given up for the day as the taste of exhaust fumes has given me a headache!I think the original milky oil problem is sorted out now, it looks much better and I'll flush some more cheapy 20w50 through before i change the filter and put the proper stuff in.Thanks for all the help Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferny Posted November 8, 2012 Share Posted November 8, 2012 Where are you located? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenie Posted November 8, 2012 Author Share Posted November 8, 2012 I'm just outside Bristol Ferny, about 15 mins from M4 J18 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard B Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 If the heater is only getting 'warm' and your engine is overheating you have a blockage or flow problem of some sort.Disconnect the radiator top and bottom.Try flushing the engine and radiator with a garden hose. Blast it through both ways to clear any blockage. Wait until the water runs clear before stopping. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alex Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 Not disagreeing with Richard but make sure your heater valve is fully opening.It wants to be open to flush the system.You should also check all the hoses are clear as the can block with crud too....particularly the heater pipes! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard B Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 Alex wrote:Not disagreeing with Richard but make sure your heater valve is fully opening.Good point. You can also take the heater hoses off and blast through there as well. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callyspoy Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 I must say, my Herald recently burst a rad pipe, whether it was this thwt caused it to overheat, or it overheated and burst a pipe i do not know (probably the former though).When i replaced the hose, i decided to replace all of them. When removing, i discovered the heater hoses were blocked, along with the pipe which runs under the manifold.After doing all the clearing out, it is infinitely better.Well worth double checking all your pipe work.2 pennies worth and all that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RedRooster Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 My manifold pipe was blocked too, strange as i cleared it out a few months ago, where does all the muck come from?RR Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Callyspoy Posted November 9, 2012 Share Posted November 9, 2012 I suppose it can never really all be cleared unless you get the block properly flushed.One day! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ferny Posted November 10, 2012 Share Posted November 10, 2012 Refill it with water and drive around for a day then drain, back-flush and repeat. That gets it clean, especially if a flushing agent is in there. Don't do it in the winter though otherwise you may run out of time, leave neat water in there which freezes and pops a core-plug and you end up driving to work with no water in the car without realising... :B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GT6 M Posted November 10, 2012 Share Posted November 10, 2012 If ye take off the block plug, and waggalate a small scewdriver,or stiff bent wire in there,wilst water is fed frae else where, then alot of crap can be got out.it all seems to settle at back, as engine is slightly tilted back.the amount of engines with the rear drain blocked ,is quite the norm.as for washing it oot, when I had the Gunge prob, bunged some dish washer tablets in,ran it for a while then flushed, then did same again, got lots of crap oot.empty block by taking blanking plug oot.then emty rad by tak,n bottom hose off. Then back flush radthis way no crud is left in rad, either top,or bottom.back flusing will remove, {hopefully} any stuff stck int tube cores.regarding yer water pump, the pump maybe ok, but the housing it sits in could be all corroded away aroont the edges where impellor fits tightly.thus no letting water go thru pump, so have a good look at the housing.before ye just bung a new,or recon pump in.M Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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