Volvo or hardy spicer universal joints

[Piero franchi]

Simple realy, which ones on the bigger UJs as on spit 1500 and GT6

the more opinions the better please

Thanks

[CharlieB]

Are you suggesting Volvo UJs fit the Spitfire?

I've just bought a pair of Freelander (Hardy Spicer) ones for my Spit but they're not greaseable so I'm trying to decide wether or not to take them back. Does anyone know if you can get greaseable Freelander ones?

[Deleted User]

our actual freelander uj's are all non greaseable, but never had a problem with it in 6 years and it gets a heck of a lot more abuse than they would in a spitfire.

[Piero franchi]

the greese one will have to have holes drilled into the middle bit, there for not as strong

[CharlieB]

What's the Volvo connection?

[Nick Jones]

Freelander UJs apparently last ok without re-greasing.

Piero, do you mean Volvo CV joints?  These can only be used as part of a CV conversion to a rotoflex setup.  Cannot be used on the swing axles.

Nick

[Piero franchi]

Hi,
I only heard volvo mentioned, hence why I asked.

I thought it was a choice between either one.

Is there then only hardly for spit and GT6

I have rotoflex and intend to do away with the dough nut, so will they be of use to me (volvo)

[CharlieB]

The only way you can do away with the donut is with a complete new cv jointed shaft like the one Canleys sell (or convert to a swing spring setup).

By the way Hardy Spicer is a manufacturer not a type of joint although some people call ujs Hardy Spicer joints like Hoovers!

[Richard B]

Piero franchi; there is a conversion you can do using Volvo 340 CV's this requires either Ford driveshafts (Fiesta) 2 x long or some people go for the MGF hub which allows MG circliped bearings.

Doing this conversion requires adapters to be made to fit between the inner CV joint and the Diff flange. We were trying to get another batch made up, but ran into a hicup. I still want to get some made though. Try searching on this forum for CV joint. Not knocking the Canley conversion but I just fancied assembling my own set. The Canleys kit is a complete bolt on package.

[lordleonusa]

I have replaced my dough-nuts with shortened TR6 siding joints, and utilise two TR6 UJs on those shafts.

Canley's CV-jointed system came out quite a long time after I had already done mine, and may be better?

Also, Volvo 121s, (Amazons) used the same small UJs as our Heralds and Vitesses.
I believe that LADA also use the same size joints,

I had a UJ fail on my Herald driveshaft in Northern Finland, and it was replaced, at a campsite with a Volvo one.

Amazing what can be achieved using rocks as tools.  ;D

L

[Deleted User]

davesideways wrote:

Not quite right as on a spifire the UJ is the lower link of the suspension it takes more load than on a car where the UJ is just used to transmit torque to the wheels...Its effectively being hammered on each bump and under constant load from two directions.

In the spitfire the UJ has to deal with torque and lateral load together.

The UJ doesn't usually form part of the suspension link or serve as wishbone link and driveshaft together. So they get a pretty hard time on a swingaxle car.

Our freelander gets used a lot offroad in the low diff and hill descent modes, these put a heck of a lot more torque through the joint than the spit ever will. Granted though the freelander doesnt use the joints as suspension setup. But the forces through the ujs are greater due to the torque but also the weight bearing on the axles and joints given the freelander weighs in at just over 1.5 tons, running a 1.8 k-series engine with 117bhp i can assure you more abuse will go through the freelander ujs.

[Clive]

I think Dave maens that ujs are really only meant to spin on teir axis, but are abused in a spit becuse they also take the full load of the suspension at right angles to that. And aggressively too.

Anyway, the freelander is the best one out there (but only genuine freelander, or you will be sold cheapo tat on fleabay!)

[Tim Bancroft]

Canley CV shafts: Now done 3,500 miles on the trial set that are fitted to my GT6. No issues at all, took alot of punishment on the 10CR up and down passes, no worries with tight hairpins etc. No problems.

I would suggest the use of either the Josh Bowler system or the Canley CV shafts are a good idea on a car that has more power than std.

Still I suppose the 200/2500 and TR4A/5/6 do ok, however the trailing arm suspension on those cars must help lengthen the life of their UJs.

Also the rotoflex couplings on mk2 Vit/GT6 do protect the UJs, I drove 500 miles with a UJ hanging of my GT6 on the last RBRR.

[Deleted User]

my laws of physics are taught by copious amounts of stella and a shock scotland win in the rugby world cup, leading to a splitting sore head and i've lost my voice this mornign.

[CharlieB]

I've done some digging & as far as I can tell there is nothing special about "Freelander" UJs. There are simply two grades of UJ standard & heavy duty, & you can get either with or without grease nipples.

In the GKN (they own the Hardy Spicer name) catalogue extract below 2 stars means standard, 3 stars means heavy duty, N means no grease nipple & S means side grease nipple. TVF100000 is the Freelander part no.

The Quinton Hazel catalogue actually specifies heavy duty for the Triumph driveshafts & std for the propshaft although they both have the cross reference GUJ115. I can't tell whether QL15002 actually has a grease nipple or not.

I asked Canleys, their RHS152 is heavy duty with grease nipple & GUJ101HD is the "Freelander" heavy duty without grease nipple but I don't know why the latter is supposed to be better unless as Piero says the grease hole makes it weaker. Maybe if Dave Pearson reads this he'll let us know.

[CharlieB]

Quinton Hazel:

[Nick Jones]

To get rid of the rotoflex coupling on the rotoflex suspension your choices are:

1. The Bowler/Jones CV conversion.  The Bowler Mk2 version also uses MGF wheel bearing and hub to do away with shimming issues and breakage of the hub itself.

See: http://www.tengaston.plus.com/Vitds1.htm#top

And: http://www.justdrive.ca/gt6/josh/cv_rotoflex.html

PM me if you want to go this route as I'm in negotiation with machine shops atm.

2. Canley Classics CV shafts; These are a straight swap for the roto shaft and therefore score highly on the convenience stakes.

3. TLD, Steve Smith and possibly others (GT?) do a sliding spline twin UJ setup possibly with special hub arrangement and larger bearings.

4. Use the MGF vertical link, hub and CV with R100 shaft and Volvo inner CV/adaptor.  This gains you disc brakes very easily as well.  There is a variant of this running on Andy Vowells racer using the R100 vertical link but I think he will be swapping to MGF very soon.

All the above are using the standard diff.  If you are not using the standard diff, choices open out and become alot more involved (and expensive).

For example: http://triumphgt6.blogspot.com/ some real artwork going on here....

also our own 2litre-e towards the end of mega-thread 'here we go' on this very forum.

Cheers

Nick

[Piero franchi]

Thanks Nick and all others for your input, good thred. Ta

Will PM you nick, as I do want to go this route on my GT6.

My spit will have differant diff and half shafts, so skys the limit.

One point to add, the half shafts and prop spin at differant rate, hence the need for differant ratings.

Also, having spocken to a prop man at lengh, he has offten said, UJs need to work, so that there bearings spin, in order to keep the wear even.

[junkuser]

The half shaft unies have to cope with the diff ratio times the drive loading of the prop unies.
The shaft unies on the Spit run too straight to get that movement required to distribute the wear, hence my decision to fit perforated steel bushes instead of needle rollers.
One thing I don't understand is why the drivers side uni has always been the one to go first.    Any suggestions?

[irish44j]

Tim,
With the Canley CV shafts, is there now enough clearance to use the Mk1 upper shock mounts (on the rear frame member) rather than the stupid upper mount on the inside of the wheelwell (which i assume was put there to clear the donut on the Mk2)?

timbancroft61 wrote:

Canley CV shafts: Now done 3,500 miles on the trial set that are fitted to my GT6. No issues at all, took alot of punishment on the 10CR up and down passes, no worries with tight hairpins etc. No problems.

I would suggest the use of either the Josh Bowler system or the Canley CV shafts are a good idea on a car that has more power than std.

Still I suppose the 200/2500 and TR4A/5/6 do ok, however the trailing arm suspension on those cars must help lengthen the life of their UJs.

Also the rotoflex couplings on mk2 Vit/GT6 do protect the UJs, I drove 500 miles with a UJ hanging of my GT6 on the last RBRR.

[Piero franchi]

With out checking first, I would say yes, no need

[Spitfire2500]

mattius wrote:

...used a lot offroad in the low diff

What's "low diff"? Freelander doesn't have a two-speed tranfer box so no low range (or low box as some call it etc etc).

[Deleted User]

Spitfire2500 wrote:

What's "low diff"? Freelander doesn't have a two-speed tranfer box so no low range (or low box as some call it etc etc).

Freelander Petrol K-series has an Intermediate Reduction Drive, which is effectivly a differently named transfer box which  is why i was saying low diff in comparison to any other k-series engined car, its what gives the freelander the offroad torque using a std k-series engine.

[Spitfire2500]

Ah OK -- see what you mean  :)

The IRD is just a transfer box by any other name...(i.e. provides outputs for front and rear props from a single gearbox output).