My 1st ever Triumph (Mk2 2500Pi)

[frenchiemk2]

soon...

[frenchiemk2]

Hi, something weird about the engine running. I suspect the  Inlet Exhaust Gasket (which is new) to create any leak : 

- Engine starts fine with choke and runs fine since it's low rpm (1000 how i set it).

- when cold and warms revs fine

- when hot, can't rev and about to die out or when can hardly rev, not turning fine and bangs sometimes

Any ideas? 

[JohnD]

If you suspect the gasket, once it is warmed up, spray something inflammable (Kwikstart,  brake  cleaner, even WD40 at suspect areas.     If there is air leaking into the inlets, then it will carry a little vapour with it, enriching the mixture, and you will hear a slight increase in revs.

JOhn

PS This is safe!   Just use a fine spray, don't dump the can on the engine!

 

Edited April 8, 2023 by JohnD

[frenchiemk2]

On 08/04/2023 at 17:36, JohnD said:

If you suspect the gasket, once it is warmed up, spray something inflammable (Kwikstart,  brake  cleaner, even WD40 at suspect areas.     If there is air leaking into the inlets, then it will carry a little vapour with it, enriching the mixture, and you will hear a slight increase in revs.

JOhn

PS This is safe!   Just use a fine spray, don't dump the can on the engine!

 

I found time to test this and yes there's a rev fluctuations at 1-2 and 3-4 injection inlets

I tightened the studs but no change...

The gasket is new but did I di something wrong? 

And should it work with seal paste?

[Nick Jones]

Looks like you have the clamps on backwards?

The little “pips” should face the manifolds. If you look closely at the ears on the inlet manifold you’ll probably see dents in the metal where they sat before.   
 

Hopefully, if you turn the around you’ll be able to get better clamping force and solve the problem.

[frenchiemk2]

Well, half effective. 😅

I turned the clamps the right way... and used a sealer that i already had  (LOWAC Perfect seal N4)

I think there's no more air leak at the admission (from 10 sec run test). An here come the troubles... the engine choked... and then impossible to fire up again... now the engine seems flooded.

If it fired up before with too much air (leak), maybe now it's lacking air when cold? I had a look at the entire butterfly system, to adjust at sight and put the plenum in place again, but no change.

i'm leaving home for a week, let's try next week... 🤨

RESTAGRAF_3112.webp

Edited April 17, 2023 by frenchiemk2

[JohnD]

Thank you, frenchie!   Gurus can't be gurus without feedback!

Yes, sounds like a diagnosis, that there was so much air getting in before that now it's rich.   But have you fiddled with the metering unit?    Once set, preferably by a dealer with the right bench test  equipment they are usually spot on and stay that way.

John

[frenchiemk2]

On 18/04/2023 at 20:29, JohnD said:

Thank you, frenchie!   Gurus can't be gurus without feedback!

Yes, sounds like a diagnosis, that there was so much air getting in before that now it's rich.   But have you fiddled with the metering unit?    Once set, preferably by a dealer with the right bench test  equipment they are usually spot on and stay that way.

John

Yes i did maintenance, but unfortunately, no Triumph/Lucas experts aroud.

I will re-read the settings ops on a doc I found (check through a outer fuell line from the metering if i remember...)

[JohnD]

Frenchie,

There are at least two such in the UK.  I used to use Malcolm at Prestige, who has retired and the business taken on by Carl Fitchett at TR Trader.    Carl, I have found, is a worthy successor.   If Revington, who I respect as much, were local to me, I'd use them with confidence.

John

[frenchiemk2]

I did the metering unit correct setting yesterday, 😅 but as i tried to fire up, no spark nore ignition : once again the rotor arm broke!

> The one that was on the car initially is partially defect, and now 2 new broke! May the ignition cap be faulty like ovalization?

The more i do things, the less it's easy to start the car, come on...😠

I also checked the brakes system, (seems rear breakes had issues when i tried 2 months ago.

Itseems i have to bleed it completely because no fluid at the rear, not enough in brake fluid reservoir.

After cleaning the rear systems seemed quite recent and good  😀(hoses, drums, shoes and cylinders). So i will not replace till the french MOT (which i hope, will be soon). 😅

Next by priority : 

- make this old lady run (didn't i write this already long time ago?)

- refurbish french vintage alloys and get tyres

- get the 2nd hand stainless steel exhaust line i spotted 300 Kms (delivery impossible)

[frenchiemk2]

For setting the metering unit, the manuels  refer to the 6th cylinder at TDC (what the h?)

Is it correct that when you are at TDC for  1st cylinder, the 6th cylinder is at top position too? (by checking to the marks on the wheel balancer)?

Is there a trick knowing the 6th cylinder at TDC  with the valve cover on place or must take it off?

[Nick Jones]

10 hours ago, frenchiemk2 said:

Is it correct that when you are at TDC for  1st cylinder, the 6th cylinder is at top position too?

Yes.

 

11 hours ago, frenchiemk2 said:

Is there a trick knowing the 6th cylinder at TDC  with the valve cover on place or must take it off?

It’s very easy with the valve cover off but can also be done by checking whether the rotor arm is pointing at no. 6 plug lead (assuming you are sure the ignition leads are correctly positioned). May also be possible by removing the spark plug and detecting whether compression is being developed as to turn the engine towards TDC.

[frenchiemk2]

Here's what i have when 1st cyl at TDC (no firing)

So... I'll take the gasket off to make sure what it figures when 6th is at real TDC.

 

Edited May 14, 2023 by frenchiemk2

[JohnD]

Spot on, Frenchie!

As the manual says, the precise position is not critical, as the injectors, unlike moderns, are some way back from the inlet valve.  But the rotor should be opening into the hole at TDC as yours is.

John

[frenchiemk2]

OMG;

no way, i have to check one thing...

[JohnD]

What?!?  Where!?! WHY????

[frenchiemk2]

8 hours ago, JohnD said:

What?!?  Where!?! WHY????

Maybe not enough fuel in the tank. But i put 15l the other time and the engine ran for max an hour. Evaporated maybe cause there's bo leak and no smell or someone stealing ⛽?

Have to check when i come back.

How should the gas cap look like? For comparison.

[frenchiemk2]

The news

I just started the car after putting fuel in the tank (evaporated i believe) that was the issue last time. The fuel gauge isn't helping and always that red warning lamp even with 10 liters.

I just set the advance and believe it's correct

The twin choke cable redone DIY

Same issues maybe that are my limits :

_ starts fine when cold

- when hot tends to shut itself

_ revs not easily and bangs sometimes

_ smells bad combustion

Maybe i have to focus on adjusting the throttles?

Forgive my bad english on vid... 

 

[frenchiemk2]

Trying to understand what why... cyl6 and 5 bang + impossible to adjust depression on 1-2 throttle unit (whereas possible on 3-4 and 5-6) and still impossible reving.

 

What i diagnose is the former mechanic did shit : SEE PICT

 

So I start from what i think is correct :

- use nearly full length of threaded shafts so that i can adjust gaps (acceleration pedal + cold start thing) and so that the throttles can open wide without hitting the header (threaded shaft throttle 1-2)

- manage tensions and springs (not efficient)

- try to find depression on 1-2 unit

 

I'll let you know if some better...

 

[frenchiemk2]

still no depression on throttle 1-2

still hard to rev

still bangs on throttles 5-6 and 3-4

Advance set is 8 BTDC (french  onboard document)

should i check again the valve clearance?

Edited August 27, 2023 by frenchiemk2

[frenchiemk2]

The news.

Sounds better but not set.

I set timing at 11° (25D Lucas vacuum unit at mid marks) but it looks like the engine wants more advance...

so i dosed between 25D/air screw and seems almost good. Cold start is good, warm engine too. Revs fine, only a little rattle at very early engaging pedal on acceleration.

 

But still impossible to balance all 3 throttles because no depression at the 1st body! (2 and 3 are well balanced ; it's an early model with only 1 air feed/balance system)

 

Checks and process : 

- done : new rubbers to mastervac and metal air tank, air valve the right way and seems functional

- done : 2 new rubbers linkage between throttles

- checked : air leaks at metering unit, 25D capsule hold depression

- ordered : new rods, swivels and springs (missed 1 at cold start that i did myself but let's do it right) at Fred Millturn (thank you Martin)

 

What else should I check?

[Martins Stag]

Just a thought, I know you have been trying to resolve this but has it been driven at all? Has it carboned up with all the static running? We have an English expression that it may need an "Italian Tune up" which translates into taking it out for a drive and giving it a good revs and some stick to clear out all the carbon? . 

 

Just a thought.....

Edited August 30, 2023 by Martins Stag

[Wendy Dawes]

Re commissioning a car is always an ordeal, but the more you drive them the more reliable they become as you iron out the teething troubles, 

[frenchiemk2]

The car has no C.T (french MOT) and still something to solve about brakes. Bleeding to be done again since 3 wheels don't brake.

Also waiting for renewal parts for the torn linkage.

Today i found sucking at the 1st cylinder 1st throttle and a little bit at the 2nd when reving... Maybe in progress...

 

Also solved the mystery of vanishing gas...

Look what was leaking under the car...

Isn't that ironic...

Edited August 30, 2023 by frenchiemk2

[Wendy Dawes]

🙄