Club Triumph Track Days 2009

[Chriss]

I would like to point out that while we are free to attend or not attend CT Track Days, or anyone else's for that matter, CT is committed to 3 track days with MGoT.  This commitment is to the tune of £11,000 for around 75 attendees.  If we do not fill our allocation at Cadwell in May, Brands in June and Oulton in November CT will have to pay MGoT for the unattended places.

We are not able to prevent others from advertising on our website, but would not seek to either, as I will be doing this on other's sites later in the year if we have a shortfall.

I am sure you are aware that the cost of the TD itsself is not necessarily the major element in the whole cost of a TD.  Getting to and from and fuel on the day can cost as much, but car preparation / repair is likely to be the greatest cost.  

When planning your TDs for the year and allocating your budget, please bear in mind CT's commitment to MGoT, which has been made on CT member's behalf in providing TDs at the best and most requested by CT members circuits at excellent value for money through MGoT.

Thank you very much

Chris
CT TD Organiser

[TimW]

Chris
the main objective to this day is cancer research.  It is not to tread on the toes of CT.  However you don't apear to list prices for the events with the mg's and the first event isn't till mid year.  Why don't CT try arranging their own track days instead of "tagging along" with the mg mob?

[TimW]

P.S.  I would love to do all 3 track days with CT if you could send me some info
Thanks
Regards
Tim

[Mad Mart]

Tim, you need about 50 cars to make a Trackday pay for itself. We struggle to get 15 usually.

Someone could have a word with the Motorsport Event guys, I guess. I managed to get 7 Dollys at Colerne last year.

[JohnD]

MGoT had 14 days last year and has four, up to May, already announced in 2009.
What will be the arrangment for CT members?
May we apply for any MGoT day or will there be specific days to include us?

JOhn

[Tim Bancroft]

John,

We have been allocated spaces at Cadwell Park in May and Oulton in November.

Chris Shaw will calrify in the new year.

[tiggrr1]

I'd be very interested in Oulton Park, If I survive the 10CR with no major car problems :)

Would be my first track day though and would need a few pointers from the more experienced trackdayers amongst you.

My car is mostly standard GT6 MKIII but I'm sure I could still have a lot of fun!

[Chriss]

No probs Sunbeam  :)  I plan to run introductory sessions for newcomers so that they can get acclimatised safely with their nerves in one piece.  In the pull down menues at the top of the website there is a section called Competitions.  in another Pull Down in there is Track Days and in that is Preparation.  Have a read and pick out the bits for your car.  Then talk to Tim Bancroft and Keith Dandrige.  They know lots about GT6s on TDs.  You may need to start preparing soon.

Look forward to seeing you at Oulton and I'll give you a ride / come out with you.

Cheers

[Chriss]

There are several points being made here, I’ll try to explain them in order:

I understand that the Mallory TD is in aid of Cancer Research and that the CT Forum is a good place to publicise it, presumably along with other Triumph related websites.  The organizers are free to do that on the CT Forum. It is in the aid of a very good cause and I am sure no one would wish them anything other than success.

The purpose of my response is to give CT Members an insight into the commitment that CT has had to make in order to provide 3 superb TDs this year for its members, at the circuits they chose, so that they can make informed choices about how they spend the resources they allocate to TDs.

As Mart implies, hiring a circuit for a TD is an expensive business, ranging from £6,000 to £25,000 depending on the circuit and the time of year.  This is money that has to be paid out several months up front.  CT is new to organizing TDs.  They are simply the most expensive thing we have ever done for the members by a long way.  We cannot just go and blow the club’s resources, so must assess the members’ benefits and risks before committing to spend money with an acceptable risk.  As we become more experienced and confident so our approach may change.  

The Competitions Committee believes that working with MGoT is currently the most effective and lowest risk way of meeting members’ demands for quality circuits at value for money prices with sessions primarily for Triumphs.  As we understand members’ requirements and the demand for TDs better we may add to the TDs on offer later.  To secure these circuits we have had to commit to 75 TD places. For this year we believe 75 places are likely to be the very top limit of demand and we will have to push to fill all these places.  There are usually about 25 places per session in an MGoT TD so 3 TDs at quality circuits spread around the country is what has been negotiated.  The timings have been chosen to fit in with the full CT Competitions calendar that includes: rallies, autotests and long distance events as some members enter events in all categories.  I appreciate that an event earlier in the year would have been desirable. Something may come up, see the last paragraph also it is possible that we may organize some informal track gatherings at circuits we have not yet been to, but these are unlikely to be exclusively Triumph.

MGoT has a membership many times the size of ours and is focused on TDs.  They have been organizing them for many years too. They can sell several TDs a year and have a good relationship with Motor Sport Vision, owner of most of the best circuits.  Because of this they can hire the circuits at advantageous prices.  We pay the same as MGoT members, so the benefit is passed on in full and CT dose not take any profit.

MGoT also have long established relationships with other clubs such as Lotus and MX5.  At the moment we are junior partners and have done well to negotiate the prime circuits that we have.  CT has done 5 – 10 TDs with MGoT.  Neither Fred nor I have heard any serious complaint about the organization, administration or execution of any of these days.  Most Forum entries have been fulsome in their praise.  Many CT members have commented on how like us the members of MGoT are and how well they have got on, giving examples of tool sharing and circuit advice etc.

I have provided on the Website Competitions Pull Down and in a separate thread all the information I have at the moment.  I do not know exactly what the prices will be other than as Motor Sport Vision have increased their prices; so they will be increased on 2008 prices, I do not yet know the date in June the Brands Hatch event will be. I will provide updates on the website and Forum as I know them.

CT members are free to apply to our listed TDs when MGoT publicise them.  We are not yet free to apply to other MGoT TDs.  However, they may come up at short notice when they release unsold places shortly before the event.  CT members will then be free to apply for them on a first come first served basis.  I will publicise these if they become available.

Thank you for your questions.

Chris

[trackerjack]

Its the same problem as always :'( Triumph clubs do not mix together well.
There are certainly enough Triumphs wanting to do track days but all the clubs are divided.
When I first joined CT I though ahha this is where it will all happen with ALL triumphs together, sadly this is not so.
We will most likely do at least one TD but being as far south as you can be we are not keen to travel right up the country.
Look forward to seeing the usual faces when we do.

[desmk11]

This is completely true and correct.

As Trackerjack has pointed out, so many triumphs clubs, so many people from each wanting to do TDs but there is no unity as with the MGs.

I have done a TD at mallory with the TR register it  was awesome but they too haven't enough interest within just themselves to warrant doing it again, even though i did try to generate some interest some time back.

I have posted some info on the dolomite club and the tr register forums, just hoping this will help, it should at least get it known to  few more people.

I would just like to add i am not actually a member of any clubs i just love all things triumph and do not in any way wish to tread on anybodies toes. I am not even sure i will have a triumph ready for the mallory day myself. :(

Des.

[JohnD]

But no one DOES anything about bringing the Clubs together!
Excepting the All-Triumph Day Committee, whose Prescott event was a great success!

It is inevitable that the dates fixed on by one club will not suit everybody, so lets spread the word about otgher trcak days involving Triumphs (as Des has done)
So, over on Dave Sideways' website, he is organising a track day at Llandow, in March.
He needs 15 and has  8 to date.
If you are keen on a track day about then, get on over to Sideways-Technologies at http://www.sideways-technologies.co.uk/forum/Blah.pl?m-1228517496/s-0/ and ask for a booking.

Me?  I need to build a new engine first.

Of course, you could go to any of the many track days that are on up and down the country.  It's fun to be with other Triumphs but that's not what track days are all about,and anyway, two or three mates can go together.   Don't think that you will be the butt of jokes by spotty youths in Saxos with baked bean cans for exhaust pipes and underfloor lighting.   Every time I've gone to one, people have gathered round to look at my ancient machine.  Maybe they come to mock but they stay to praise!

Happy New Year!
John

[GT6boy]

I have every intention of attending some of the the CT days(icw MGoT) and hopefully Dave's day at Llandow.
Doing the CT Trackdays last year has really invigourated my interest in Triumph ownership. To be honest, I was beginning to think of getting rid of the car as i was getting bored of it, until I went to one of the trackdays- what a blast. The people are good on these days, keen to help and no-one is left feeling like 'the new boy'.
Gentlemen- start your cars ;D!

[Deleted User]

the thing with sticking with the MG on track guys at the mo is that they have the same attitude to driving their cars as we do ,so it's a more civilised event , whilst you can pitch up as a group to any track day you may well find it filled with not so likeminded people....i'm sure Chris will fill you in on the exact aims for the Ct track days but i'm sure as we get more and more people interested then things will hopefully become more more triumph orientated

[trackerjack]

I agree Doug and although it is not a race i do love to play a bit and with only 15 Triumphs take away the break downers (me last time) I just get bored on an empty track, apart from a nice pusuit with Tim Of the Bancroft (Coneslayer) my usual track companion is Mad Mart. I do like lots of different cars to play with and a Triumph only day would be great.
We just need MORE Triumphs.

[Raider]

More Triumphs?

Well we are doing our bit by also making the CT trackdays part of the Driver Challenge (1 to count).

We hope to encourage more people to do just a bit more - if that happens it adds up to alot more activity :)

Something I am surprised about tho is why people don't give more events a go anyway - I hope the Driver Challenge will have some effect here over time. After all if you can do a couple of trackdays then why not the HCR and, for example, the Bocardo Autosolo which I am sure many would love if they gave it a chance.

[Deleted User]

60 odd triumphs on a track day would be a great sight, but to do that on a regular basis ,say 3or 4 times a year would take a base of 100+ people and as yet there is not that sort of following ,
i know that Chris is compiling/updating the list of people interested in track days so anyone who is interested and reckons their not already on the list should contact him and let him have their details

[Tim Bancroft]

Got to agree with all of the above.

Always amazed that more do not do TDs, they def. benefit ones driving skills and the understanding of the car. I think people worry that they will damage their pride and joy, something that is not necessarily correct. Its very much up to how one approaches the day, balls out from the off and yep a prang is on the cards, take it easy and build up the speed and no worries. Also the conduct of driving at the CT MGoT TDs is as well mannered and respectful as could be hoped.

Never understood why the TR Reg day at Mallory was not better supported. I think it is time for the Triumph clubs to get together and organise one. 60 cars: say TR Reg: 15, TSSC 15, CT 15, 2000/2500 reg 5, Dolomite Club 5 others 5. Blimey seems easy! We have a CT Comp Ctte meeting on the 29th Jan, reckon this should be discussed.

MGoT Track Days: Come on, come and have a go, guaranteed enjoyment! I have now done 3 TDs (Silverstone GP, Goodwood and Cadwell Park) that match the enjoyment I have had using my cars-I have no doubt that further TDs will be as much fun.

[Lord Sorbington]

Maybe instead of just expressing surprise and complaining that more people don't do track days, this another of those situations where you should ask why people aren't doing them?  ;)

Personally, I can think of nothing I'd want to do less and the last thing on my mind when I bought an ancient Triumph originally designed for bank managers to waft around in was to go tear arsing around a race track in it or to take part in any sort of timed or competitive events, they just hold no appeal whatsoever.  There's also the issue of money; the cost of fuel, increased wear and tear and maintenance on the car are considerations as is issue of getting home if you do prang it, quite apart from the fact that you may total your car altogether.  If I had a trackday BMW or something, I could view that as a disposable item, not the case with the Triumph.  That said, even when I owned the 944, the thought of taking part in trackdays didn't enter my head.  

My mate has done a few track days at Donington in his Lotus 7 style kit car which he has enjoyed but factor in the fees, fuel costs and tyres and they haven't been cheap days by any stretch of the imagination.

On top of all this, there's also the concern that my tea would spill due to the spirited cornering involved in such events.

[desmk11]

Who asked pesto anyway?  ;D

He's a virgin you know. :P

[ferny]

Quote:

Maybe instead of just expressing surprise and complaining that more people don't do track days, this another of those situations where you should ask why people aren't doing them?  

Personally, I can think of nothing I'd want to do less

And? Yeah, rather obviously there are people who have no interest in track days. There are people who aren't interested in endurance events either. And also people who don't want to use a forum or the internet in general. A constructive point is not "I have no interest". The people who have no interest have nothing to offer in way of advice and there's little which can be done to interest them in if they've already made their mind up. Indeed, their reaction of "not interested" and nothing else can be likened to a stroppy kid folding their arms and going "I don't wanna!" and stamping their feet. Or perhaps walking into a shop and going up to the counter to declare that they have nothing you wish to buy before walking out.

I think the real question to ask is "what can we do to entice the people who may be interested into learning more about the days and possible choosing to take part". Slowly the number of people taking part in such things has increased and I believe it's down to word of mouth. People getting excited about the event they've taken part in when talking to their friends and then their friends wanting to experience the same.

As for it being tough on the cars, I'm not too sure. You don't have to go balls out just because you're on a track. I was talking about this on Sunday and I don't feel it would be any tougher on my car than my normal driving. Just like the RBRR wasn't any harder on the car as it was simply driving - which I do in the car anyway! I've just done 35 mile journey in just under 30 minutes in the Herald. Other than not having to be cautious and wary of others baking suddenly for no reason or pulling out in front of me when there is no room on the motorway I don't see a track day being more wearing on the car. Especially taking into the account the state of the roads we drive on every day compared to a track surface. On a car where it doesn't have to be driven so hard or simply isn't, then a track day would be harder on it. I'd not do a track day in the 2000 because I don't want to drive it that way. The Acclaim, maybe. But I have no fears as to how well the Herald will cope which is why it's used every day with normal driving and for autotests which ARE hard on the car.

[GT6boy]

ferny wrote:

Other than not having to be cautious and wary of others baking suddenly for no reason....

;D! Lookout- their doing an emergency Bap application!!!!!!!

Apologies for edit, but that 'typo' made me laugh out loud in the Office :B

[Lord Sorbington]

Ferny, Ferny, Ferny.  Have you had another mishap with the hair dye, is that why you're grumpy? I'm not sure what baking has to do with things either, there's clearly a lot I don't understand.

Tim and others have expressed surprise that more people don't do track days etc., I was just explaining why they hold no appeal for me and why I never came to any.

My point is that if you do consider the track days or whatever to be poorly attended, then it may be worth making the effort to ask people why they don't come instead of just complaining about the fact that they dont!!

[Tim Bancroft]

Not really sure why Alan felt the need to come on and say that he ain't interested in TDs?

[Lord Sorbington]

timbancroft61 wrote:

Not really sure why Alan felt the need to come on and say that he ain't interested in TDs?

I explained it in my posts Tim but I'll run through it again;  Maybe if you made the effort to understand why more people don't take part in track days or events you'd be able to take action, make some changes and perhaps encourage more people to get involved?