Spitfire MKIV Restoration Newbie.

[LouisW]

You're probably right! I'm just trying to save the pounds! Will i be fine to fill up the system with vinegar and keep it like that for abit to remove all the rust from the system? In my mind it seems like it would work Just dont want to damage anything further...

[drofgum]

Louis,
The vinegar treatment has been advocated on the Triumph Experience Forums' Spitfire and GT6 forum as an economical way of cleaning rust out of the cooling system. No complaints of bad side effects have been posted, so it seems to be OK.
                                                                                                                            Cheers,
                                                                                                                            Paul

[LouisW]

Ordered some goodies Was hoping to get everything fitted this weekend but the snow has decided i'm not going to

[LouisW]

Woah, been a long while since I updated this thread. I've gotten alot of things done and gone over a few other things that I'd done as a temporary repair.

The spitfire now rolls freely and the rear brakes are unseized! Both rear wheels were painted white by me just temporarily.

I managed to free up the master cylinders and I cleaned them all up putting in new seals throughout. I've not yet filled up the system with brake fluid but will see if they leak in the future.  



I also removed the carbs and inlet manifold in order to get to the side of the engine better giving them a clean up which ended up making them look much better.



Whilst I had the side of the engine free, with much persuasion I managed to get the old rusty water pipe off and installed a nice new stainless steel one. Whilst I was there I also installed a new core plug as the old just wasn't there!



I then removed the rad and removed the water pump and housing again. I cleaned off the rust and added a converter onto the housing and then reinstalled them with new gaskets. No more leaks! However what I have found is a pinhole leak in the radiator which i'm going to need to get sorted.

I wasn't very pleased with the bulkhead so I stripped back the paint I had put on and sanding it back. I then used some red gloss paint onto the shelf and re-installed everything. Looks alot better.


You can still see some primer as I have the rest of the bulkhead to paint up.

Next up was spraying up the radiator (before I get chance to have it re-cored) and paint up the chassis after removing the rust. I also sprayed up the valance brackets whilst I was at it.





I'd previously removed the rust from the doors but the rust had left some pitting. I set to fillering up and repriming these areas of the door and now it feels like glass. It felt much better and is ready for a final coat (whenever that may be! )



I had been having issues with the solenoid and replaced that.



The engine now turns over on the starter motor but I've not yet been able to get it started. I believe the fuel pumps shot as it's not drawing fuel into the carbs.

I found some more rust towards the back of the sills and cut this out. I spied into the sills and inside they're really not that bad. It's just the back of the rocker which needs replacing.



As some of you also know I had some rust issues with my hardtop and I had a go at replacing this with some rivets, steel and filler.

This is how it looks at the moment but I will probably just buy a new hardtop in the future. This is only temporary.



There's not much else to really say. I'm starting to lack motivation to carry on with the build as I dont have the money for a welder or know anyone with one. I'll try to keep going but the amount of work is a little overwhelming at the least.

Here's the final picture of what the car currently looks like.



You guys have been a great help.

Louis.

[LouisW]

I got some more work done today on the spitfire.

Took the front LH wheel off and took a look at the brakes. The calipers weren't bad but the discs were just abit rusty. Not worn down or grooved and the pads also looked new.



I stripped some more rust down from the top wishbone and chassis.








Still got the otherside to do and the lower wishbone. Ran out of time today though  

[Doug Paterson]

Serious point.

That little jack you are using is for changing wheels, not for propping up the chassis when you are working on the car.

Get something safer.

[LouisW]

Yeah, I've been looking to purchase some axle stands recently. I wasn't working underneath the car, I'm not that stupid!

[LouisW]

Whilst waiting for my parts from James Paddocks I set to getting some bodywork done, well... I'd call it uncovering rust and bodges!

I took the lights off and all the chrome trim inspecting areas for major rust, only light rust fortunately.



I had another delve around the wings and found a previous bodge. Someone had put a metal panel in and bondo'd it then undersealed it. Didn't stop the rust from eating underneath though...



I'm wondering if the repair patch like this - http://jamespaddock.co.uk/PartImages/jpr703r.jpg?t=20120426034406

would be large enough to cover the rust up and repair it? I'd need two for each side, the rusts about equal on both.

Whilst looking in the boot aswell someone had gone abit crazy with underseal.
I found this giant lump in there.

[jamespworth]

I would say you may just get away with the repair panel. I noticed your comment on attaching the front valances earlier in the thread, with them being FG i used large pop rivets which has worked well. 😉

[LouisW]

Good idea on the pop rivets! I'll certainly look into it

I have had the carbs off the spitfire and the needle/ dashpot was seized inside so it didn't rise up and down. I've had this off and cleaned them up so they work very nicely now.



I also was allowed to put the carbs into the dishwasher! However, when they came out it seems there was still some bits of "tablet" powder on the carbs. I've tried my best to remove it with white spirit and water and it got some off however not all of it. Will this disappear with the petrol once it's all back together? Dont want anything causing problems.

I also removed the rust from the back of the spitfire and gave it a spray with primer.

[JohnD]

If 'er indoors will allow, the dishwasher can abe a good parts washer.
But dishwasher detergent is VERY alkali, and alloy parts do NOT do well in an alkali cleaning solution.
Tales of them being left in a bath overnight and completely dissolving!
No harm done as far as I can see, but don't do it again!

And Louis, a repair patch is NOT used "to cover the rust up"!
THAT is Bodging!
You cut out all the rusty bits, cut you patch to fill the aching void with a small margin to weld it on, cover it all in weld-through primer and get busy with the welder.

John
(These young lads, what can you do?  They've got to be told!)
Big Smiley!

[LouisW]

Quoted from JohnD

If 'er indoors will allow, the dishwasher can abe a good parts washer.
But dishwasher detergent is VERY alkali, and alloy parts do NOT do well in an alkali cleaning solution.
Tales of them being left in a bath overnight and completely dissolving!
No harm done as far as I can see, but don't do it again!

And Louis, a repair patch is NOT used "to cover the rust up"!
THAT is Bodging!
You cut out all the rusty bits, cut you patch to fill the aching void with a small margin to weld it on, cover it all in weld-through primer and get busy with the welder.

John
(These young lads, what can you do?  They've got to be told!)
Big Smiley!

No,no,no! I know I have to cut the rust out before hand. I meant "cover the rust up" as in be large enough to fully fill the hole where all the old metal will come out.

I actually put the main carb bodies into the dishwasher (not the dashpots pictured) but even though they're cleaned on some bits of the carbs there are speckles of white which I guess is from the tablet. I tried with white spirit to remove it, and with lots of water but it seems to have almost stuck to the carb.

Will this disappear with petrol? Its been thoroughly rinsed but didn't get it off.

Louis.

[LouisW]

I just tried wiping it with petrol and the white comes off, I believe it was some of the powder from the tablet just sticking. All gone now! 😀

[jamespworth]

Quoted Text

No,no,no! I know I have to cut the rust out before hand. I meant "cover the rust up" as in be large enough to fully fill the hole where all the old metal will come out.

I knew what you meant 😉

[thehanko]

Good effort mate.

Projects like this have highs and lows. The main trick is not to resent the project just the individual task that's being a bugger!

I would try to pick a system and rebuild it start to finish - cleaning up rust / paint as you go. I think this will help you maintain motivation.

Eg you have don't the master cylinders and freed up the rear brakes. I would pull apart all the brake cylinders clean then, repair or replace what's needed then change the fluid. Bleeding is easy once you know how. Then brakes are done and you feel great. Then clutch etc etc and tick off bits.

Another cheap but necessary bit of the build will be your electrics. Every build and switch needs pulling apart and cleaning of contacts. In my gt6 at least 2/3rds of switches had corrosion and every rear light had earth issues. Every switch bar one was repairable and my rear light glow like the sun now and didn't cost a penny.

As for the welder. Second hand basic migs will cost bugger all - gasless is perfectly good and between the welding forum mentioned earlier and a few hours playing with your sheet metal you will be sticking metal together - not like a pro but well enough for a first project.

Good luck.

[LouisW]

Quoted from thehanko

Good effort mate.

Projects like this have highs and lows. The main trick is not to resent the project just the individual task that's being a bugger!

I would try to pick a system and rebuild it start to finish - cleaning up rust / paint as you go. I think this will help you maintain motivation.

Eg you have don't the master cylinders and freed up the rear brakes. I would pull apart all the brake cylinders clean then, repair or replace what's needed then change the fluid. Bleeding is easy once you know how. Then brakes are done and you feel great. Then clutch etc etc and tick off bits.

Another cheap but necessary bit of the build will be your electrics. Every build and switch needs pulling apart and cleaning of contacts. In my gt6 at least 2/3rds of switches had corrosion and every rear light had earth issues. Every switch bar one was repairable and my rear light glow like the sun now and didn't cost a penny.

As for the welder. Second hand basic migs will cost bugger all - gasless is perfectly good and between the welding forum mentioned earlier and a few hours playing with your sheet metal you will be sticking metal together - not like a pro but well enough for a first project.

Good luck.

Thanks 🙂

I'v rebuilt the master cylinders and they just need fluid which I have in the garage, all brakes are already freed off I've currently just been working on tidying the engine bay up a little but whilst I get tired of problems with that I move onto body work. I hope the problems with my lights are just down to the earths! Lucas electrics eh 😀

I've been looking on ebay at second hand migs however my brother and neighbour (my brothers a mechanic, my neighbours an ex panel beater) are going to ask around for a mig welder.

I just got the carbs all polished up and back onto the spitfire however I have lost the choke retaining clip somewhere and have just ordered another... I only notice this today after making my order at paddocks yesterday, typical

Anyway, I'll get some pics up soon and thanks for the support

Louis.

[LouisW]

After getting help from my neighbour today we got the ht leads set to the right order and she fired right up! Success!

This is the first time in 30 years the spits actually started, I'm so chuffed! 😀

I'm just worried about the valves as there was no spark plug in the number 1 cylinder when it sat for 30 years. I had vacuumed them out and poured oil into the spark plug holes but worried I might do some damage if anything got in there. Is this a possibility?

I have some oil coming from the oil filter which I will need to replace (I have a new one I just need to do an oil change) but other than that she purrs!

Thanks for all your help

Louis (First start 15/6/2013)

[Saltddirk]

Louis
Are you telling us that the oil is 30 year old?

I would change it without running her any more. Lot of chemistry going into oil to make it do it's thing and protect your engine.

Dirk

[LouisW]

The oil was still golden with no grit or dirt in it. She only ran for a couple of seconds! I tried removing the drain plug but its rock solid, got it soaking in wd40 at the moment.

[JohnD]

The oil was still golden.
After 30 years sitting in the sump doing nothing all the muck will have settled to the bottom, leaving the top of the oil, yes, golden!
Agree with Dirk.

John

[LouisW]

I removed the drain plug and drained the oil, its not dirty and after sticking a finger in the sump there's not much sludge. I'll wait a bit then refill her :p

[thehanko]

I would pour that oil back in run it for a few minutes get it warm and then drain it along with settled junk personally. As long as it has some lube normal idle conditions aren't going to do damage.

Sure old oil is unlikely to give the long term support the engine needs but we are not talking about a Porsche here we are talking about a 70's built British engine.

I've never seen black oil 'settle' out to clean oil. Amasing if it does I feel.

Otherwise drop the sump pan off and clean it of the settled debris before wasting new oil in there only to pick all that up again. Easy job.

[LouisW]

I ran the engine for a bit before removing it and drained it for an hour. With the help of my mum we got some New oil into her! New filter and magnetic drain plug and im very happy!:p

Been a pretty productive day :p

[thehanko]

Great. I bet your mum was chuffed to see it running again. Nice work.

[LouisW]

I found this today... It fell into my oil pan (not when draining oil) and I'm unsure what it is. Some have said its a bonnet cone with the rubber bit gone. Ideas?