What have you done recently or are planning to do soon to your Triumph?

[glang]

oh dear I think we're getting mixed up again but you said:

'No, wrong again. The pump is positioned between the inlet and outlet of the block, so the thermostat ONLY shuts off the radiator route. The coolant still circulates around the block through the pump.'

So if this is true then when the mechanical pump is removed and an ELECTRIC pump installed in the bottom hose theres nothing to force the water through the block! The water will go from the new pump to the inlet of old empty pump housing and straight out of the vacant thermostat housing to the radiator.

The only way the new system will work is if the old pump and block are in series so that water goes from the new pump to the old pump housing through the block to the thermostat housing without returning to the old pump as you suggest and then off to the radiator....

[Matt306]

2 hours ago, glang said:

Nice bit of kit and would love one on the Vitesse but I suspect its quite expensive😯 This is their solution to the heater return, a T adaptor fitted to the suction of the pump....

Indeed they are pricey however I snapped my combo kit from Demon Tweeks for 202 the next day they were back to 285 I guess a mistake was made but fair play they honoured the price.

The water pump for the TR7 is 286 so this should be a good investment and avoid any jackshaft jams

Edited December 3, 2022 by Matt306

[glang]

I dont think thats bad at all when a 123 programmable dizzy is the best part of 500!

Wheres your temperature signal coming from and will you control an electric fan as well?

[Matt306]

16 minutes ago, glang said:

I dont think thats bad at all when a 123 programmable dizzy is the best part of 500!

Wheres your temperature signal coming from and will you control an electric fan as well?

On the attached pic you'll see an Injection manifold for the TR7 it's different to the carb manifold as is the water pump cover.

If you follow the outlet pipe to the left a bit you'll see three sensors one is for the dash one for the ECU and there is another I have replaced with the thermal sensor for the water pump. 

Yes it controls the fan by switching the earth for a relay

[RobPearce]

16 hours ago, glang said:

So if this is true then when the mechanical pump is removed and an ELECTRIC pump installed in the bottom hose theres nothing to force the water through the block!

No, that is not a valid deduction from my (correct) statement. There is a return path that allows the hot water exiting the block to return through the pump. This is required so that the pump isn't pushing against a blockage when the thermostat is closed. If you remove the pump, that path remains. However, while some of the water will take that path (and bypass the engine completely) some will still take the longer (but mostly fatter) route through the engine.

[glang]

No, thats why, the Vitesse anyway, has a circuit through the manifold and/or heater and back to the pump - so theres always a circuit even with the thermostat closed. For a long time because of the diagram in the WSM I thought the same as you and then I checked the waterways in the pump housing where, to my surprise, you can plainly see theres an entry into the block from the pump discharge but the return goes straight to the thermostat housing with no path to the suction of the pump. When the thermostat is closed there cant be any circulation in the engine apart from a small amount that goes through the thermostat bleed hole and off to the rad.

All of the pump output (except the manifold/heater bit) goes through the block, out through the thermostat to the rad - for efficiency why would you do it any other way? 

[iani]

GT6 Mk1 - More progress on setting up DCOE's, it's not quite right and I will have to have another go on the valve clearance, idle never sounds great on video but at 3k it sounds really strong. I couldn't take it for a test run as the block drain tap is weeping, I have ordered a plug to sort it out.

2.5 PI -  a friend had shown me the rear view mirror he'd bought from the Range in his TR7 V8, I decided to get one, only £20 with built in dash cam. Obviously not the best quality but a good field of view, my car is under a cover, hence odd pic.

TR6 - No work but gave it a good thrashing this morning, great to have it out, not getting enough use these days.

[Guppy916]

Here's a close up of my set up, I was lucky with my rocker cover style, I took a 1mm drill and drilled just through the raised rib on the top for the spring return, and your connecting arm I cut a slot for the cable to drop through with a soldered on fitting to locate in the hole, and another 1mm hole just below for the return spring.

Rimmers part number https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-156353

[iani]

On 05/12/2022 at 18:46, Guppy916 said:

Here's a close up of my set up, I was lucky with my rocker cover style, I took a 1mm drill and drilled just through the raised rib on the top for the spring return, and your connecting arm I cut a slot for the cable to drop through with a soldered on fitting to locate in the hole, and another 1mm hole just below for the return spring.

Rimmers part number https://rimmerbros.com/Item--i-156353

A neat solution but I won't be using an ally rocker cover so not an option for me I'm afraid. I will have to stick with the setup I'm using now. I am going to a twin cable operation too, I had a cable snap last year and want to mitigate against a recurrence. 

[glang]

On 04/12/2022 at 11:28, glang said:

No, thats why, the Vitesse anyway, has a circuit through the manifold and/or heater and back to the pump - so theres always a circuit even with the thermostat closed. For a long time because of the diagram in the WSM I thought the same as you and then I checked the waterways in the pump housing where, to my surprise, you can plainly see theres an entry into the block from the pump discharge but the return goes straight to the thermostat housing with no path to the suction of the pump. When the thermostat is closed there cant be any circulation in the engine apart from a small amount that goes through the thermostat bleed hole and off to the rad.

All of the pump output (except the manifold/heater bit) goes through the block, out through the thermostat to the rad - for efficiency why would you do it any other way? 

Ive investigated a bit more and now see where the confusion lies! The TR7 has a later design than the earlier Triumphs and the thermostat is dual acting so as Rob said, on cold start up water circulates through the engine and back to the pump. Then when hot enough it closes the return to the pump and opens the discharge to the radiator.

With his electric water pump Matt must either keep the thermostat working correctly or, if removing it, BLOCK the return connection to the old water pump suction (I see on eBay that some U.S. housings seem to come like this anyway). Either way of course there will be no circulation round the engine during warm up and although this hasnt been a problem in my Vitesse for 50+ years its got to be noted it hasnt got an alloy head... 

[Wendy Dawes]

Flat battery on Mabel, so did a Basil Fawlty 

gave it a damn good thrashing lol,😉 -   not really,  put battery on charge and started up ok, , next major job fitting overdrive gearbox and twin carbs (when I find some) then alternator conversion, sick of charging the battery as she still runs on dynamo, they’re a pain 😔

[Rosbif]

57 minutes ago, Wendy Dawes said:

sick of charging the battery as she still runs on dynamo, they’re a pain

Nothing wrong with dynamos, just very often they are asked to do more than they are designed for.

The one in my 13/60 does the job fine, but then I don't run additional equipment nor use the lights, nor sit with the engine idling in traffic often.

Although I will admit to putting the battery on charge a couple of times over winter 'just in case' when I hardly use it.

If I did have to buy a replacement I could be persuaded to go for an alternator, just.

[RobPearce]

1 hour ago, Wendy Dawes said:

sick of charging the battery as she still runs on dynamo

As Rosbif said, there's nothing wrong with dynamos. My first Vitesse ran a dynamo its entire life and I used it in all weathers and all times of day & night. When the battery was tired, I actually found the dynamo worked better for rejuvenating it than an alternator. If the problem is that you don't use Mabel enough then fitting an alternator will not help at all. If it's a leak from some aftermarket accessory, then an alternator will not help at all.

[Clive]

2 hours ago, Wendy Dawes said:

Flat battery on Mabel, so did a Basil Fawlty 

gave it a damn good thrashing lol,😉 -   not really,  put battery on charge and started up ok, , next major job fitting overdrive gearbox and twin carbs (when I find some) then alternator conversion, sick of charging the battery as she still runs on dynamo, they’re a pain 😔

Wendy, how long for the battery to go flat?

I wonder if there is a parasitic drain on the battery. Yiou need a multimeter set to amps (200mA should be enough) disconnect the battery negative terminal, and put a probe on the neg battery terminal and the earth clamp. You should get zero or a very small number at worst. 

If you are not confident, or own a meter, bribe somebody at your area meeting to assist. Or dare I say Darren...

[Wendy Dawes]

It’s only because I’m not driving her enough and as you know a dynamo in this cold weather ( -5  this morning) isn’t the best.   The charging is good  no drain , just the fuel drains back after standing fur a few days, and the manual pump isn’t the best. So by the time the engines cranked over enough to pull the fuel through, there isn’t enough left in he battery to start it  plus the battery isn’t exactly new although it’s still holding good charge I’ve  got a multimeter and can use one,  but again can’t find it in my shed of many bits lol I’ll have a good sort out  over Christmas  🙄

just a classic problem lol  cheers Clive 😊👍

Edited December 8, 2022 by Wendy Dawes

[glang]

Dont forget batteries are made up of plates in parallel and series so you can lose some and still have the normal 12 volts but less current supply capacity. The only way to test for this is a battery discharge test but most people just buy a new one....

[Wendy Dawes]

Mabel’s battery is the one she came with when I bought her in 2020 during lockdown and is an old type battery with 6  vent caps, so she is probably due a new one, maybe a birthday pressie 👍

[glang]

I think you'll find a big improvement as long as all battery, starter motor and engine earth  connections are really good🙂

[Wendy Dawes]

Yes all the electrics are good, I took the loom out and put new wires where needed (the lighting circuit had been subject to burning out at some point) and new connectors all through, then re-covered it with new loom tape as well as putting in line fuses on the horn and light circuits and also new battery leads 👍 

[glang]

All of the low current stuff will continue to work with some resistance in its connections but the starter motor circuit's must be as low as possible. These are battery earth to body, body earth to engine and live cable connections with the last one including of course the starter solenoid internal contacts. Luckily its easy to detect problems with any of these by feeling for a temperature rise in them during spinning of the engine🙂

[Wendy Dawes]

 I’ve also got one of those battery disconnectors which I make sure is removed when parked up so the  battery isn’t being subject to any possible parasitic drain when she’s not in use which does help 

[glang]

Trouble is thats a little bit more resistance in the starter motor circuit☹️ There really shouldnt be any external drain but of course all batteries lose current internally and theres not much we can do about that although its probably related to temperature and the quality of the battery...

[Wendy Dawes]

2 minutes ago, glang said:

Trouble is thats a little bit more resistance in the starter motor circuit☹️ There really shouldnt be any external drain but of course all batteries lose current internally and theres not much we can do about that although its probably related to temperature and the quality of the battery...

👍👍😊

[iani]

GT6: My goal was to get the car running well enough that I can drive it to Northampton Motorsports for a rolling road session to get the carbs set up properly. I have had many challenges getting to this point but today it was actually running quite well, the fuelling isn't correct under load but I think I have probably gone as far as I can for now.

TR6: A large parcel arrived for my wife today, the Racestorations labels on it would suggest it is a replacement front spoiler, the current one hit some roadkill, bad move. I will fit it after painting, sometime after Xmas no doubt.

PI: parts keep arriving, new gearbox surround trim came today, along with a S/H choke cable, the ends were frayed at the MU on the current one prohibiting full retraction reliably

[iani]

A bit chilly for spannering but needs must:

GT6 Mk1: leaking block drain tap removed, Rimmers had decided to send me a radiator tap as a replacement, a quick call to a friend resulted in a Spit 1300 engine donating its block drain plug. Car sounds sweet, looking forward to RR session on 10/01 and having DCOE's set up correctly

PI Saloon: Very large package arrived yesterday, rear sunblind all the way from Oz. It looks good but I'll fit once its a bit warmer out there.

TR6: More neglect I'm afraid, seriously considering moving this one on

Mk1 2000 Estate: I have bought another car, it was delivered by Radders yesterday, for now it is in a compound, it will be receiving the front struts & brakes off my PI, these are being swapped out next week. I have ordered what I need to do a Pos to Neg conversion, will change to alternator at the same time.